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Congrats! When did you receive your acceptance?
Congrats! When did you receive your acceptance?
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Has anyone received second round offers or regrets as of yet?
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Nope
still waiting to hear back from Trinity and NUIG 5 year program!- Joined
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Got the news on May 2nd. Can't wait to go to Ireland, and glad I finally got in (this is my third cycle, so I was getting worried about having to have a fourth).
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SameNope
fingers crossed for you!The information/deadlines on the website for UCD and other schools is for applicants who applied through CAO. The application process and timeline for applicants applying through CAO is different from the process you are going through with the Atlantic Bridge Program. You should not pay attention to any of the deadlines/offer dates on schools' websites as these are for CAO applicants and not for people applying through ABP. I would contact the ABP if you have questions about your application timeline.
And yes, August seems late for most Americans, but the majority of Irish/EU applicants get acceptances in mid to late August during Round Zero (initial offer round) and Round One (the second offer round a week later). There are some applicants who get offers earlier (e.g. Round A).
Irish schools are not at all like US schools in terms of the admission process. US schools admit students and fill their class throughout the entire admissions year. The majority of Irish admissions offers are released on the same day in mid to late August (i.e. one month before the start of school). This is called Round Zero. Second round offers go out the next week during Round One. Some people do receive admissions offers before August (e.g. Round A in July), but the majority of applicants don't hear anything until Round Zero/Round One in August.
This probably seems very late for most Americans, but the Irish admissions system is very different from the more holistic university admissions process in the US/Canada. Irish university admissions are almost entirely dependent upon the results of leaving cert (i.e. exams at end of high school) or results of university degree (i.e. first, 2:1, 2:2 degree). For medicine courses, for example, students can't be admitted unless they achieve a certain number of points on their leaving cert or have at least a 2:1 degree. This means that Ireland can't really start giving out admissions offers before the end of the schools year.
Also, unlike the US admissions process applicants where applicants receive multiple admissions offers and then make a decision, in Ireland, applicants only get accepted to a single course/school during an offer round. Applicants must make decisions about their course preferences before the offer rounds and submit a list ranking their course preferences (i.e. 1. UCC Medicine 2. UCD Medicine 3. UCD Physiotherapy, etc.). During the offer round, applicants receive an admissions offer to their highest rank course that admitted them.
I think part of the reason North Americans apply through the Atlantic Bridge Program and not through the CAO like all other applicants is because this system/timeline is so different from the American/Canadian system. Applying through ABP means that North American applicants can be admitted outside of the normal Irish admissions timeline since you are working through ABP and not CAO.
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Does anyone know if UCC does a White Coat Ceremony for their 4 year GEM program? Also, I'm curious about when the winter break starts (last week of November, 1st week of December, 2nd week or 3rd week of December?). I believe summer break starts in May though from my research. Thanks guys.
Can't help you with the white coat ceremony, but UCC's academic calendar listing term dates is available on their website. You likely have to contact UCC to find out about any white coat ceremony.
Hey, I got accepted to UCD GEM entry on March 21.
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There is no white coat ceremony. In fact I don't think I even touched a white coat as it is not common to wear one on the wards in Cork. Usually Winter break starts Mid Dec in the past. Usually a 2 week break. It could potentially be longer but the issue is that after December exams, there is an oral week where you kind of have to wait around and see if you get called in and such.
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I can't speak for the UK, but your right in that Irish schools do have affiliations with US programs that will allow you to arrange an elective that might otherwise be closed to you. When I last checked, Harvard was still a lottery system. You can also arrange electives through personal connections with any physicians you know in the USA. I have had classmates who successfully secured clerkship in this manner. In addition, some of the more well-known programs may look at your USMLE scores. When your choosing an Irish school, keep in the mind the policy for doing electives abroad. Some schools don't allow you to do core rotations abroad while others will. Lastly, if you become very desperate you can pay a for profit program to arrange some clinical exposure, but the experience is generally not that great.
I am so confused with this delay from NuIG and TCD. We are just waiting and waiting!! Let’s say someone gets accepted on August? This person won’t have his or her mind ready or focused to move to another country in just a short of time before school begins! I start to hate “no news it’s a good news’
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I feel your frustration. August is so late. Especially when you’re planning on selling your house and car to move across the world
Clown Doctor
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I got into the 4 year program at UCD. I got my offer a week after applying through ABP. phdtomduk is probably right that those who apply through ABP are admitted outside the normal timeline.
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Many Congrats! Do you mind sharing your stats? Planning to apply next year and UCD is my first choice.
Nicole5555
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Hello, I am extremely interested in applying to this program. But there isn’t much information on chances of matching back for a residency in the US after. I am a US citizen but would love to study abroad. Do you know if going this route makes it harder to get a us residency or not? Any other advice you could give me for this?
Thank you.
Thank you.
Clown Doctor
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Thanks for the congrats.
College GPA 3.94 (Summa Cum Laude) on transcript. Because I did badly in my first year, the AAMC calculated GPA was only 3.54.
MCAT 511 (2nd try) 509 (first try)
EMT certified (Did two 12 hours shifts at a EMS centre, shadowed three different hospital departments for a total of 32hours)
member of SPS (Physics honor society), ODK (Leadership honor society) and Universities own honor society.
Did a lot of tutoring before and during college and participated in an overseas mission trip.
I do think that the personal statement essay, resume/CV and recommendation letters plays a big role.
When I had my interview, the interviewer said that he did not receive all my files from ABP and asked for my MCAT score (Even thought I was informed by AB more than a week before that my file was completed, they must have missed out sending my MCAT score to UCD).
I got accepted 5 minutes into the interview.
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UCD doesn't have interviews...
Clown Doctor
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I did have an interview though through skype. I applied for the second round of intake. If it is possible I can PM you to show you my interview invite, my Skype call from the Associate Dean of Medicine, and also my offer letter.
Do you have high MCAT ?
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513 MCAT, with a decent undergrad gpa (cum laude, honors, etc.), 4.0 graduate in biotech, lots of clubs, published research, volunteering and shadowing. I met all the requirements and benchmarks, and had great stats, but did not get in during the previous cycles. Still, got in eventually and glad it's in Ireland.
How many schools did you apply to/what was your school list? Your gpa is on the lower side, but still within the range for many schools. Your MCAT is above average for many schools and your ECs sound fine. If you got interviews, that should mean there are no red flags. With a carefully selected school list you should've had an acceptance.
Being an IMG is an enormous disadvantage. It is extremely expensive, and matching to the US is not guaranteed. Staying in Ireland is not an option. For many Canadians, it seems like it is often the only choice because the admissions standards with regards to gpa are so high (often >3.75/3.8). Matching for Canadians seems to be an even bigger risk for Canadians due to the difficulty of matching to Canada as an IMG and the restrictions the Canadian government places on J1 visas.
As a US citizen, you should really try as hard as possible to get a position in a US school if you're trying to match in the US. For you, it looks like you'd have a really good chance if you made a smart school list. Your GPA/MCAT/ECs/interviews suggest a fixable issue- probably school list. Do a WAMC thread and ask SDN where you went wrong and what you need to do to improve. It wouldn't be too late to apply to this year's cycle. The worst case would be doing research for another year and building valuable connections that you could leverage if you end up needing to go to Ireland next year.
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I applied to 15 schools each year of the three separate cycles of applications, not counting the Irish schools in the last cycle. I received interviews each year, and spoke with the admissions committees for feedback after each cycle. I selected schools carefully, with roughly 10 schools each cycle with average gpa and mcat below my stats, including in-state schools that admit to giving preference to in-state students. The remaining schools included 4 schools with average acceptance stats equal to my own, and one school with average stats above my own. Among the schools were a school whose admission board included a mentor of mine, one whose director I had worked with in the past, and one in which I was already taking the medical school coursework for year one (not an exaggeration, the med school students were in the same classroom, with the same professor, and taking the same tests) as part of a graduate program. According to all the schools that provided feedback, there are no major red flags anywhere in my application.
I know that being an IMG puts me at a disadvantage with regards to matching in the US. I know that it is expensive; shockingly, all med schools are. However, according to the tuition and fees UCC has provided, the tuition per year is less than the out-of-state tuition of most of the out-of-state schools I applied to. The rent in nearby locations is likewise comparable to rent near US med schools, and the insurance is dirt cheap. I know that a US school would provide the highest likelihood of matching in the US. Honestly, I'm not fixated on where I match so long as I can practice somewhere. If I end up matching in the US, I'll practice here. Same if I match in Ireland, England, Australia, or anywhere else (locations taken from countries in which American applicants studying at Irish schools have matched). The goal here is to be a practicing doctor; the location is only a secondary objective. I'm not going to throw away an acceptance to a medical school to gamble on the crapshoot (gambling term intended, though other interpretations of the word may also be appropriate) that is med school admissions. The odds are not getting any better, so I'm going to take my winnings and go.
I only offer this advice because you sound like someone who really should be able to get a US acceptance. If you got US interviews, I agree that this means you likely don't have have any red flags. I still think it might be your school list. For someone with a lower gpa (lower, but still within an acceptable range) you probably needed to apply to a wide range of schools. This is especially true if many of the schools within your range were "low yield" schools (i.e. Georgetown, GW, Tufts, Jefferson, Tulane, Brown, BU, Loyola, Rosalind Franklin, Drexel, Commonwealth, Temple, NYMC, Penn State, Albany, Rush). These schools end up being statistically more competitive than Harvard/upper-tier schools because they get way more applications. If you didn't apply to a wide array of mid and low-tier schools in addition to state schools, and you weren't from a good state, your school list could be a reason why you don't have an acceptance.
Is there a reason you did not apply to DO schools? An acceptance to a DO school is typically preferable to going abroad, as the match rates are much higher.
You are absolutely right about the cost being about the same (US private vs Ireland). Cost of medical education in US is absurd. That said, there is a significant difference in postgraduate opportunities in US vs Ireland. Something like 98% of US medical school graduates match to residency programs. Only about 50% of IMGs match. You also seem to be misinformed about your opportunities to practice medicine if you do not match in the US. As a US citizen, you will have no option to match to Ireland/Australia/UK/Canada, so if you do not match to the US, you will not be able to practice medicine. This is why going overseas for medical school is such a gamble.
Ultimately you have to do what is best for you, but it might be worth it to re-examine staying in the US and re-applying to MD/DO.
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Among the schools I applied to, I did include mid and low range schools. The state schools actually showed more interest over all three cycles, with more interviews at state schools including out-of-state schools. I am not from a great state for matching (Alabama), but was consistently interviewed in-state and received interviews out of state.
My reason for not applying to DO schools is mainly due to an absence of DO shadowing. Neither my undergraduate nor my graduate universities had many DO physicians nearby. I contacted all of them. Among those who responded to my emails, none had openings for shadowing at any point during the last few years.
There seems to be some misunderstanding regarding matching abroad. From the Atlantic Bridge Website:
American and Canadian citizens are eligible to apply for any remaining residency positions,
Training in the UK is generally the next most popular option for graduates who wish to remain in Europe. The General Medical Council is the authority which regulates medical training in the UK. Be advised, EU citizens are generally given first consideration.,
Irish medical school graduates have undertaken postgraduate (residency) training throughout the world, including the Middle East, Australia, North America, Asia, etc.
While it is true that European residencies give first consideration to EU students, being a US citizen does not disqualify me from applying to match in Ireland, nor anywhere else in Europe. I verified that these opportunities were present by directly contacting two of the Irish medical schools (UCD and UCC) and by contacting the General Medical Council in the UK. The opportunities are limited, but they do exist.
With regards to the match rate of IMGs, the 50% issue applies to graduates of all international medical schools, averaged together. According to the NRP's Charting Outcomes in the Match for International Medical Graduates (1st edition from 2013, because the 2016 edition does not include data on match rate by country), the match rate for graduate of Irish medical schools was 70% at the time of publication. I contacted UCD (prior to receiving my acceptance to UCC) and they confirmed that 70% of North American applicants to the US match are typically accepted, with UCD having all US Americans who applied to the match over the past year receiving an acceptance.
While the chance of matching in the US would be higher if I was accepted into a US school, I was not. The comparison is not 70% vs 98%, it is 70% vs maybe I will get lucky on my fourth try. My stats are not in any way or form improving by adding another year of applications. My GPA, shadowing, clubs, research, volunteering, etc. for applications are all fairly unalterable (at least in any positive direction) through anything short of getting a PhD. In summary, I will take "more difficulty in the match, but still have a good chance and can match" compared to "didn't even make it that far".
Didn't mean to suggest throwing all your eggs into one more application cycle and giving up if that didn't work out. I just thought reapplying might be worth some consideration. Ireland will still be there next year, and building research connections will only help when it comes time to do summer research and clinical electives.
Ireland does seem to do better than some other countries and it could be an excellent option for you. You have to do what's best for you. Clearly you've done a lot of research, which is good because at the end of the day, ABP is offering a service and trying to attract people to their service, so people should do their own research.
Regarding matching to Ireland/UK. You are technically correct that it is theoretically possible for you to match to Ireland but your chances are so small that it is actually almost impossible. In 2015, Ireland changed their Intern allocation process so that Intern positions are now allocated in the following order: 1) EU/EAA CAO Applicants 2) EU/EAA and other work permit exempt individuals 3) Non EU/EEA Nationals. Within each category, intern positions are allocated strictly based upon centile (i.e. class rank). No other factor (e.g. test scores, ECs) are taken into consideration. In 2016-2017, out of the 726 intern position in Ireland, 678 went to EU/EAA CAO applicants, 33 went to other EU/EEA individuals and only 15 went to non-EU/EEA nationals, meaning only 2% (15/678) of positions went to non-EU/EEA nationals. Since positions are given out based upon class rank (people are ranked nationally), you would have to be amongst the highest ranked individuals in the country to secure an intern position, in a country with an extremely high number of international students.
In the UK, the GMC changed the rules regarding graduates of non-UK medical school requiring that they have the right to work in the UK in order to be eligible for the foundation programme. But if you called and got different information from the UK foundation programme, maybe I am wrong about this? Might be worth double checking though? It is also unclear how Brexit will affect all of this.
Side note: As someone who has lived in the UK for the past 10 years and is going to medical school in Europe I am actually a huge fan of Europe and the European education system. I just think there is a lot of bad information out there. If you do end up going to Ireland, welcome to this side of the pond!
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I understand. If this was my first application cycle, I would certainly have reapplied and tried to make more connections over the following cycle. Research positions and master's programs designed to help improve chances of getting in during a second or third application cycle are fairly common and generally a safer option. Even the best international students will have to deal with some residency programs that refuse to accept international graduates. I would recommend that anyone considering applying to international medical schools reapply at least once before committing to an international school. But, ultimately, it seems to me that Ireland will be a good option for me.
The UK/Ireland intern match rate for Non EU/EEA Nationals is minuscule. I just mentioned it in the interest of showing all the options available. If I somehow am offered an intern position in Ireland (or anywhere for that matter), I will take it in a heartbeat. I still intend to take all steps of the USMLE and do a clinical elective in the US, in the likely event that I am not offered an intern position in Ireland.
I will double check with the foundation programme regarding intern positions. Of course, there's always a chance that Brexit will result in a loss of positions, or that US residency positions will suddenly refuse to accept international graduates.
I actually wanted to thank you for starting this conversation. It seems like there is a shortage of accurate information regarding international medical schools, and I think that reading this thread will be helpful other students interested in international medical education. Do you mind if I ask which European medical school you are going to?
It is so hard to find good information. The ABP website seems a little misleading about residency prospects in Europe, but I think thats probably because the situation has really changed in the past few years. Up until a few years ago, international students in Ireland could get residency positions in Ireland/UK. It wasn't guaranteed, but it was much easier. Now that Ireland prioritizes EU CAO grads it is almost impossible for international students to get positions.
In the UK, there is a two tiered system that differentiates between graduates of Uk medical school and graduates of non-UK medical school. Grads of non-UK medical schools must have the right to work in the UK (e.g. UK/EU/EEA national). When I say we don't how Brexit will affect this, I mean that right now all EU/EAA nationals have the right to work in the UK, but post-Brexit they will not automatically have the right to work in the UK. EU/EEA nationals will have to apply for a residency permit to work/live in the UK. We don't know whether the UK foundation programme will adapt thier eligibility criteria and continue to accept EU/EEA nationals. Either way, this likely will not affect you.
(side note: as someone going to live in Ireland during the next year (Brexit officially happens next Spring) you are likely going to hear a lot about Brexit and what an absolute mess it is)
Fortunately, while there is always talk on sdn and elsewhere of the US cutting the number of IMG residency positions, the number has been relatively consistent for years. The US is definitely your best chance for residency. If you fall in love with Europe, you can always move back to the Ireland/UK after residency in the US because both recognize US residency training.
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Has anyone received any rejections from any of the Irish schools?
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I wondering the same thing as well. I was speaking to a friend of mine who went to UCC and she mentioned that a few of her classmates received their acceptances well into July. So there's still hope until we hear otherwise!
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I recieved a rejection from RCSI today
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You need to finish medical school before you can go into residency.
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This is not true, at least in any accredited med school I have researched. Caribbean schools can start rotations in their third year, depending on the program. Most schools (US, Canada, Caribbean, Ireland) will do rotations in years 3 and 4; this is normal. Caribbean schools do not allow someone to start residency before finishing their fourth year. If you've been accepted to UCC, I would recommend choosing that rather than second guessing it with another international med school (unless you are set on the Caribbean; pick the place you think you will like the most and will best prepare you for residency and medicine).
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No for any med school you need to finish before doing residency but at caribbean schools they do clerkship in the states while for ireland, they do clerkships in ireland (and you can get certain ones in other places but the majority are in ireland from what I've heard)
I also got a "regret before interview" email this morning from RCSII recieved a rejection from RCSI today
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Sooo glad for you.
Well done, you deserve it.
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Are you applying for the 4 year program?
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Thanks. Good luck; hopefully, I'll see you in Ireland.
Yes. I applied to UCC, NUIG, and Limerick, and RCSI all for the 4-year GEM programs.
So far, I've only heard back from RCSI.
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I got the same one today. I applied for all the 4 year GEM programs. Waiting to hear back from the others as well
I haven't received anything yet. Last time I reached out to Atlantic Bridge was middle of May and they said my application was on "reserve" and second rounds would be sent out in the middle of June. The two programs I applied to were the the 5 year in Galway and Trinity. Has anyone else heard anything from either of these schools?
Thanks!
Thanks!
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Received rejections from RCSI (two days ago) and UL (today). Hopefully there is still a chance with the other schools.
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Well that's good news cause I got a rejection from Limerick earlier this week.
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I got the same this past week as well
Hi, just to jump in here: I read earlier that they don't favor non-trads. Is that true? I graduated from a US university 3 years ago and have been working/doing patient organizing since then...i didn't realize this would be unfavorable. Can anyone speak to this?
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Has anyone heard back from UCC or UCD reference second round offers or regrets?
Congrats! would you mind if I PM'd you as an applicant for 2019?
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Rejected from TCD
