Is this the wrong time to cut back hours and pay?

[Splenda88]

Just trying to understand what you mean by this ? For me, in my area when it comes to houses I need what I need. Part of my burnout recently has been attributed to lack of space (1400sq ft) and inability to work out as before (no room for home gym). The days out of the house are actually better but ultimately part of my job is 40 hours of remote work from home during the week. That is a TON. My wife is also going to be working from home potentially in the next 12 months.

When I first lived in the area the house i dreamed of having was 600-700k maybe 5 years ago. All those houses are now worth 900k plus. It really sucks and then you add almost 6 percent interest. Yes, I could find a starter house for 600k actually one for 650k yesterday but we would move in 3 years max. The question is that's a huge hassle but so is trying to find the house we want. With interest rates so high people in those higher end houses ain't letting go of the 3 or sub percent interest so it's even harder to find those same houses now in general.

Dilemma I have to figure out in 8 weeks is do i take the plunge and pay 850-1m for the house i will live in for 10 years plus or be cheaper and get a starter house for 650ish that is just "adequate" but the notion is I will absolutely not be there more than 3-5 years guaranteed when interest rates go down and there is more house turnover.

I meant to say people tend to spend more when they start making more.

I would go with a starter home if I were you. Something between 2600-3000 sqft since it appears that you live in MCOL area.

If you want to avoid a 6%+ interest rate. You can do an 10/1 ARM like I did with Huntington at 4.25% last year in July. It might be 4.75% now.

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[finalpsychyear]

I agree with the above, prepping for a future where the US stock market plunges 50 percent and does not recover seems misguided. In that scenario, we are talking catastrophe and a real change in global order. Under such circumstances, the idea of stable returns goes out the window. If your goal is to work very hard until you have 50x (for instance of 100k) to cover this you might set your kids/grandkids up to never have to work, but you are unlikely to ever escape the hamster wheel.

I'm on course by end of 2025 given the market returns to normal returns let's just assume 25x NW if I don't change anything of course it's not guaranteed but could be in the ballpark.

Money doubles every 10 years? So if i went part time after achieving 25x and used every penny and saved nothing, 50x could happen in 2035 and I would be about to hit the big 50. Could be 2030 if I push it till end of decade instead of going PT, but that's probably a stretch.

Please explain what is wrong with my thinking. I always thought the key to wealth is getting there asap without burnout and scaling back and not touching your nest egg for a decade. Is it wrong to push myself if i am potentially so close but it requires my current level of effort (45ish clinical hours/wk).

Update: I did play tennis, ran 5 miles on an ideal cool day, and did 2 days of compound lifts, 2 date nights, saw 8 houses since i posted this last week so life is still good overall and i took today off lol. Granted I used to workout at least 5 days but this is an ok start. I think i am just annoyed at the housing market which has been an added pressure and time suck.

 

[sloh]

If you’re not at risk of burnout, hustle baby. Your initial post sounded like you were burning out to me. But if not, hustle!

 

[Bartelby]

I'm on course by end of 2025 given the market returns to normal returns let's just assume 25x NW if I don't change anything of course it's not guaranteed but could be in the ballpark.

Money doubles every 10 years? So if i went part time after achieving 25x and used every penny and saved nothing, 50x could happen in 2035 and I would be about to hit the big 50. Could be 2030 if I push it till end of decade instead of going PT, but that's probably a stretch.

Please explain what is wrong with my thinking. I always thought the key to wealth is getting there asap without burnout and scaling back and not touching your nest egg for a decade. Is it wrong to push myself if i am potentially so close but it requires my current level of effort (45ish clinical hours/wk).

Update: I did play tennis, ran 5 miles on an ideal cool day, and did 2 days of compound lifts, 2 date nights, saw 8 houses since i posted this last week so life is still good overall and i took today off lol. Granted I used to workout at least 5 days but this is an ok start. I think i am just annoyed at the housing market which has been an added pressure and time suck.

Fair enough, if I understand correctly you plan to live on $100,000 and will have $2.5 million by the end of 2025? And from 2025 onward, you plan to work enough to meet all expenses and allow the $2.5 million to grow such that by the time you would live on your investments you would have $5 million (in approximately 10 years)? If you are not really burnt out, for example if that plan gets you motivated and excited, it actually seems reasonable. I like placing concrete end-dates to avoid the temptation to keep building more and more wealth to ward off progressively worse worst-case scenarios, but if the numbers are roughly as you mention above your plan could really be workable.

My point is more along these lines: you can always imagine a scenario where your savings fail you. This would typically involve a change in the market such that investments gradually lose value or stagnate versus inflation. The amounts needed to remain early-retired in that scenario would be massive. A better strategy, in my mind, is to have enough to meet most reasonably likely scenarios and to maintain your medical license / board certification such that you can easily pick work back up (or increase hours) if you choose to. That way financial security is pretty much guaranteed, even with savings amounts lower than the classic 4% rule.

 

[finalpsychyear]

Fair enough, if I understand correctly you plan to live on $100,000 and will have $2.5 million by the end of 2025? And from 2025 onward, you plan to work enough to meet all expenses and allow the $2.5 million to grow such that by the time you would live on your investments you would have $5 million (in approximately 10 years)? If you are not really burnt out, for example if that plan gets you motivated and excited, it actually seems reasonable. I like placing concrete end-dates to avoid the temptation to keep building more and more wealth to ward off progressively worse worst-case scenarios, but if the numbers are roughly as you mention above your plan could really be workable.

My point is more along these lines: you can always imagine a scenario where your savings fail you. This would typically involve a change in the market such that investments gradually lose value or stagnate versus inflation. The amounts needed to remain early-retired in that scenario would be massive. A better strategy, in my mind, is to have enough to meet most reasonably likely scenarios and to maintain your medical license / board certification such that you can easily pick work back up (or increase hours) if you choose to. That way financial security is pretty much guaranteed, even with savings amounts lower than the classic 4% rule.

I have realized that without a house and kid and/or nanny and a spouse entering the workforce by q4 this year, these questions are difficult for me to fully comprehend or answer.

Spending now is somewhere in 100-120k range. only debt is 2 cars about 20k/yr will be paid off in 2026. The mortgages/prop tax I am considering would add 30k to our current expenses plus whatever else goes with a house yard work/maintenance/repairs/higher utilities etc. you know better than me but trying to get a house newer the better to minimize this.

How much is a 1-2kids if public schools are being used I don't know. 2000 for 1 kid and 3k for 2 kids per month? Will we travel less and save money there.. maybe. Worst case scenarios I have 120k current expense plus the new house 30k plus 2 kids (36k/yr) = 186k so just round up to 200k for safety till the cars paid off drops it to 180k ish?

 

[TexasPhysician]

I'm on course by end of 2025 given the market returns to normal returns let's just assume 25x NW if I don't change anything of course it's not guaranteed but could be in the ballpark.

Money doubles every 10 years? So if i went part time after achieving 25x and used every penny and saved nothing, 50x could happen in 2035 and I would be about to hit the big 50. Could be 2030 if I push it till end of decade instead of going PT, but that's probably a stretch.

Please explain what is wrong with my thinking. I always thought the key to wealth is getting there asap without burnout and scaling back and not touching your nest egg for a decade. Is it wrong to push myself if i am potentially so close but it requires my current level of effort (45ish clinical hours/wk).

Update: I did play tennis, ran 5 miles on an ideal cool day, and did 2 days of compound lifts, 2 date nights, saw 8 houses since i posted this last week so life is still good overall and i took today off lol. Granted I used to workout at least 5 days but this is an ok start. I think i am just annoyed at the housing market which has been an added pressure and time suck.

Where would you rate your enjoyment of psychiatry? If I hated work, I would definitely continue hammering it out and exit as quickly as possible.

That said, I enjoy work. I have kids, and you never know what life will throw at you. I can’t get back these years with my kids while they are young and impressionable. Right now, I don’t see myself fully retiring unless I am disabled or cognitively impaired. Racing to the finish line thus doesn’t really help me.

I do save fairly aggressively, and net worth ignoring my primary residence has surpassed 7 figures. Right now, there is nothing I really want to do differently.

In the future, I may decide to do more tele from exotic locations, but we don’t want to do that with young kids. Organized sports are important to them, and we have family nearby.

Instead of working hard each week (hard being 40+ hours/week), I prefer to work on building sustainable income streams. This is real estate, clinics, etc. Eventually I hope that I don’t need to even worry about my annual clinic income.

It isn’t hard to invest in successful real estate that can generate significant rental income in 10+ years.

 

[clozareal]

I have realized that without a house and kid and/or nanny and a spouse entering the workforce by q4 this year, these questions are difficult for me to fully comprehend or answer.

Spending now is somewhere in 100-120k range. only debt is 2 cars about 20k/yr will be paid off in 2026. The mortgages/prop tax I am considering would add 30k to our current expenses plus whatever else goes with a house yard work/maintenance/repairs/higher utilities etc. you know better than me but trying to get a house newer the better to minimize this.

How much is a 1-2kids if public schools are being used I don't know. 2000 for 1 kid and 3k for 2 kids per month? Will we travel less and save money there.. maybe. Worst case scenarios I have 120k current expense plus the new house 30k plus 2 kids (36k/yr) = 186k so just round up to 200k for safety till the cars paid off drops it to 180k ish?

$310,605 for each kid, much of it in the early years with paying a nanny/preschool which clears up when you send them to public elementary school.

You can also take out less than the already conservative 4% rule and take out 3% of what you have saved up. This will be difficult when having kids though to plan, but completely do-able if you plan to work part time since you'll need to draw less out from your retirement. You may not be able to take some of that money out regardless until you reach a certain age unless you put it into non-retirement accounts.

Hitting the financial independence number doesn't mean you have to retire early (i.e., not work at all). You went to school and training for so many years. There is some level of pride and meaning you likely find in your work as a result of all that accumulated knowledge and hard work. The benefit of being FI is that you can take more risks: working part time, taking on other investment opportunities such as real estate, some people actually work MORE after FI but in an endeavor they really love like your own business (may be unrelated to medicine). You may save more by not paying for disability/life insurance. You can also take less risk with your investments (decrease your exposure to stocks, don't invest on margin). You can stop doing unpleasant parts of your job/life such as admin work (hire), housework (outsource), cooking (eat out more). Lots of things you can do once you hit FI without retiring early.

 

[finalpsychyear]

Where would you rate your enjoyment of psychiatry? If I hated work, I would definitely continue hammering it out and exit as quickly as possible.

That said, I enjoy work. I have kids, and you never know what life will throw at you. I can’t get back these years with my kids while they are young and impressionable. Right now, I don’t see myself fully retiring unless I am disabled or cognitively impaired. Racing to the finish line thus doesn’t really help me.

I do save fairly aggressively, and net worth ignoring my primary residence has surpassed 7 figures. Right now, there is nothing I really want to do differently.

In the future, I may decide to do more tele from exotic locations, but we don’t want to do that with young kids. Organized sports are important to them, and we have family nearby.

Instead of working hard each week (hard being 40+ hours/week), I prefer to work on building sustainable income streams. This is real estate, clinics, etc. Eventually I hope that I don’t need to even worry about my annual clinic income.

It isn’t hard to invest in successful real estate that can generate significant rental income in 10+ years.

Some background first. I didn't have a field jump out at me really during medical school but i had it narrowed down to anesthesia and psych for different reasons. Anesthesia I thought was the best money to hours and psych I thought was just super chill, relaxing, and felt might give me more insight into myself. I didn't love that i probably wouldn't make more than 200-250k which is what i was told and had family concerned why i was choosing the field . Didn't match anesthesia. Enter psych.

1. PP 1.5 days/wk: I enjoy the business aspects, the control and schedule and ability to take vaca however i want. Dislike the form filling, pre auth, staff issues, chasing pts to pay their copays or balances. There was a time I was seeing 30-35 pts in a 12 hour day but it was burning me out. As I have achieved more savings I only see 20-24 and the days now went from dreading how busy it was to a much smoother 7-8 hr day.

2. telepsych/hybrid job: Enjoy that I have 0 issues to think about outside just the patients and notes. Even though I make half per hour vs PP, I find it so chill since my panel is mostly all stable maybe 1 new patient/day only cause i increased hours. I don't like admin push to dictate schedule, meetings to hear how documentation needs to be a certain way in case audits require paybacks, why clinic $ is down though everyone is super busy (too much overhead imo),

Ultimately, number 2 I call my "retirement" job as I could be somewhere tropical and kicking back while doing this.

I am not sure what this all says about my interest. I would love to read more but the article path has 30 articles for me to plow through, I've never attended any conferences as it is a loss of money for me as a contractor, I do desire to go through that NEI website through stahl but I am always time strapped with my schedule. I do enjoy reading and learning about psych and new meds/treatments/etc and do use my uptodate daily.

For me at least, anesthesia did not end up being the best money/hours. I only laugh at my younger, foolish self thinking I had failed in a monetary sense by choosing my field thinking I should have been a dentist/investment banker/IT.

 

[TexasPhysician]

Some background first. I didn't have a field jump out at me really during medical school but i had it narrowed down to anesthesia and psych for different reasons. Anesthesia I thought was the best money to hours and psych I thought was just super chill, relaxing, and felt might give me more insight into myself. I didn't love that i probably wouldn't make more than 200-250k which is what i was told and had family concerned why i was choosing the field . Didn't match anesthesia. Enter psych.

1. PP 1.5 days/wk: I enjoy the business aspects, the control and schedule and ability to take vaca however i want. Dislike the form filling, pre auth, staff issues, chasing pts to pay their copays or balances. There was a time I was seeing 30-35 pts in a 12 hour day but it was burning me out. As I have achieved more savings I only see 20-24 and the days now went from dreading how busy it was to a much smoother 7-8 hr day.

2. telepsych/hybrid job: Enjoy that I have 0 issues to think about outside just the patients and notes. Even though I make half per hour vs PP, I find it so chill since my panel is mostly all stable maybe 1 new patient/day only cause i increased hours. I don't like admin push to dictate schedule to 20min med checks instead of 30min, 1 monthly meeting to hear how documentation needs to be a certain way in case audits require paybacks ( they never have), why clinic $ is down though everyone is super busy (too much overhead imo), and monthly meetings with cmo to review internal note audits, productivity. I'm not a w2 but so far have just played ball though not sure I should be in those things.

Ultimately, number 2 I call my "retirement" job as I could be somewhere tropical and kicking back while doing this.

I am not sure what this all says about my interest. I would love to read more but the article path has 30 articles for me to plow through, I've never attended any conferences as it is a loss of money for me as a contractor, I do desire to go through that NEI website through stahl but I am always time strapped with my schedule. I do enjoy reading and learning about psych and new meds/treatments/etc and do use my uptodate daily.

For me at least, anesthesia did not end up being the best money/hours. I only laugh at my younger, foolish self thinking I had failed in a monetary sense by choosing my field thinking I should have been a dentist/investment banker/IT.

Conferences are great as a contractor. Choose the conference based on destination only. 4 day conference means 4 conference days (or partial conference days) + 4 vacation days that are all tax deductible. That’s 8 days with travel, hotels, and expenses tax deductible.

I’ve even attended a conference on headaches because I liked the destination.

 

[splik]

Conferences are great as a contractor. Choose the conference based on destination only. 4 day conference means 4 conference days (or partial conference days) + 4 vacation days that are all tax deductible. That’s 8 days with travel, hotels, and expenses tax deductible.

I’ve even attended a conference on headaches because I liked the destination.

I wish this were trust but it is not per the IRS:

Trip Primarily for Business​

You can deduct all of your travel expenses if your trip was entirely business related. If your trip was primarily for business and, while at your business destination, you extended your stay for a vacation, made a personal side trip, or had other personal activities, you can deduct only your business-related travel expenses. These expenses include the travel costs of getting to and from your business destination and any business-related expenses at your business destination.

 

[TexasPhysician]

I wish this were trust but it is not per the IRS:

Trip Primarily for Business​

You can deduct all of your travel expenses if your trip was entirely business related. If your trip was primarily for business and, while at your business destination, you extended your stay for a vacation, made a personal side trip, or had other personal activities, you can deduct only your business-related travel expenses. These expenses include the travel costs of getting to and from your business destination and any business-related expenses at your business destination.

The IRS will measure your time away in days. If you spend more days doing business activities than not, your trip is considered "mostly business". Your travel days are counted as work days.

How to Deduct Business Travel Expenses: Do's, Don'ts, Examples

If you're self-employed or a 1099 contractor, you can claim the business travel tax deduction. You don’t have to be flying first class or staying at a fancy hotel. Here's everything you can — and can't — write off, and how to take this deduction.

www.keepertax.com

 

[forchinet121]

The IRS will measure your time away in days. If you spend more days doing business activities than not, your trip is considered "mostly business". Your travel days are counted as work days.

How to Deduct Business Travel Expenses: Do's, Don'ts, Examples

If you're self-employed or a 1099 contractor, you can claim the business travel tax deduction. You don’t have to be flying first class or staying at a fancy hotel. Here's everything you can — and can't — write off, and how to take this deduction.

www.keepertax.com

I read it and I don’t understand how the IRS will be able to prove you didn’t do what’s required. I mean you can fly to cancun for a conference go to the conference for 10 minutes then call the entire thing a business trip, how would the IRS know how long you were at the conference for?

 

[TexasPhysician]

I read it and I don’t understand how the IRS will be able to prove you didn’t do what’s required. I mean you can fly to cancun for a conference go to the conference for 10 minutes then call the entire thing a business trip, how would the IRS know how long you were at the conference for?

I’m not sure anyone can be absolutely sure how long you were there. The conference itinerary and claimed cme would be pretty good proof of the value of the trip.

Our jobs require cme for licensure. Without a license, we can’t earn revenue to pay taxes. That should make 1-2 conferences per year ordinary and necessary which is a requirement for a tax deduction.

Owning your practice or being a contractor has huge tax deductions like this. A local realtor holds parties in which he has details of nearby mansions laid out. His foods and drinks for the parties are then tax deductible and people remember him when it comes time for a real estate transaction.

 

[finalpsychyear]

Conferences are great as a contractor. Choose the conference based on destination only. 4 day conference means 4 conference days (or partial conference days) + 4 vacation days that are all tax deductible. That’s 8 days with travel, hotels, and expenses tax deductible.

I’ve even attended a conference on headaches because I liked the destination.

Just to follow up on this. I probably don't deduct enough as a 1099. Did a deep analysis of spending and realized that when i quote my 100-120k/yr spending I am counting lots of things that are tax deductible such as health ins (12k/yr), vehicle (10k/yr), cme online, dea/license renewals, ehr monthly fee, etc.

What I realized is counting those things as a 1099 and saying you are spending 100k/yr for example is not exactly similar as a w2 saying they spend 100k.

Suffice to say I saved 63% of gross last year after deducting for all business/personal expenses. Makes me think I was probably in the 70 percent range prior to being married. So this is why I am maybe a little bit ahead in the savings department and would encourage more to do IC instead of w2.

I wouldn't even call myself frugal anymore. Wife and I haven't cooked dinner ONCE in 2023 since surrounded by healthy options sushi, pho, chipotle, Japanese steakhouse, etc. We spend heavy on food, travel, activities, happy hours and 50% of our amazon purchases are supplements. Athletic greens for 2 is 150/mo but worth it so far.

 

[Mad Jack]

This FIRE stuff reminds me of when I was a kid playing RPG video games where I would spend hours researching builds and stockpiling all the potions, doing all the tedious side quests, and then the game's suddenly over and I have 200 potions in my inventory.

Same

 

[psychmd03]

Thanks for chiming in. Yes, you are right. I haven't made it. I do tend to think similar to you. Even someday reaching the magical 25x doesn't really help me as I tend to think and then the market drops by 30-40 percent and you are screwed. Hitting 50x would allow you to stay above even a 50 percent decline. Back on the hamster wheel and guess let's see where end of 2025 has me before i change anything.

I think you are pretty much there TBH. I am also "there" but I am not even close to burnt so I would much rather continue to work hard now not knowing the future of work or our nest egg and make sure it is a fat as possible because I would rather be able to spend more in retirement than have to learn to to budget when I hit 70 because the market wasn't the best and I didnt quite build the egg large enough.

Just trying to understand what you mean by this ? For me, in my area when it comes to houses I need what I need. Part of my burnout recently has been attributed to lack of space (1400sq ft) and inability to work out as before (no room for home gym). The days out of the house are actually better but ultimately part of my job is 40 hours of remote work from home during the week. That is a TON. My wife is also going to be working from home potentially in the next 12 months.

When I first lived in the area the house i dreamed of having was 600-700k maybe 5 years ago. All those houses are now worth 900k plus. It really sucks and then you add almost 6 percent interest. Yes, I could find a starter house for 600k actually one for 650k yesterday but we would move in 3 years max. The question is that's a huge hassle but so is trying to find the house we want. With interest rates so high people in those higher end houses ain't letting go of the 3 or sub percent interest so it's even harder to find those same houses now in general.

Dilemma I have to figure out in 8 weeks is do i take the plunge and pay 850-1m for the house i will live in for 10 years plus or be cheaper and get a starter house for 650ish that is just "adequate" but the notion is I will absolutely not be there more than 3-5 years guaranteed when interest rates go down and there is more house turnover.

I think spending in the places that give you the most joy back are very worth it. If going with a "larger" house than the standard "starter home will end up allowing you to put in a gym and office and have space to keep you feeling great then to me that is a great spot to spend. No true reason to buy if you are going to just bounce out in 3 years you end up just paying mostly interest and get no equity build up which people seem to forget when they talk about rent just being thrown away. Mortgage interest for the first 5-10 years easily dominates principal paydown. Personally, I like good food, and fun experiences, and I live in a 3 bdr apartment that is truly not needed for me but I like it and gives me a ton of happiness to have. I dont buy things so I save a lot and spend aggressively in the few things that actually give me happiness. So I would say think about what will make you happier at a disproportionate level.

 

[finalpsychyear]

Same

Except game over is around mid 40s for me. At that point I really only want to work to pay my expenses and max out 401k. 2-3 days/wk or 25 ish hours. Or once i feel the burden of retirement savings pressure lifted by 2025 I may simply drop to 40 hrs and start investing in other things to diversify since the market is really the only thing so far. I also have a strong urge to try and just mostly pay off my future house in the next 3 years but i think that's a psychological achievement and not the best use of capital.

I have found working out and playing tennis which is a big hobby of mine again was really all I was missing maybe didn't realize how much it kept things in balance. The housing hunt is truly annoying so that's been time consuming. Fingers crossed that's figure out in 4-6 wks.

 

[Mad Jack]

Except game over is around mid 40s for me. At that point I really only want to work to pay my expenses and max out 401k. 2-3 days/wk or 25 ish hours. Or once i feel the burden of retirement savings pressure lifted by 2025 I may simply drop to 40 hrs and start investing in other things to diversify since the market is really the only thing so far. I also have a strong urge to try and just mostly pay off my future house in the next 3 years but i think that's a psychological achievement and not the best use of capital.

I have found working out and playing tennis which is a big hobby of mine again was really all I was missing maybe didn't realize how much it kept things in balance. The housing hunt is truly annoying so that's been time consuming. Fingers crossed that's figure out in 4-6 wks.

I'm hoping to be done around 48, but I'm starting my attending career around a decade later than most

 

[Mad Jack]

$310,605 for each kid, much of it in the early years with paying a nanny/preschool which clears up when you send them to public elementary school.

You can also take out less than the already conservative 4% rule and take out 3% of what you have saved up. This will be difficult when having kids though to plan, but completely do-able if you plan to work part time since you'll need to draw less out from your retirement. You may not be able to take some of that money out regardless until you reach a certain age unless you put it into non-retirement accounts.

Hitting the financial independence number doesn't mean you have to retire early (i.e., not work at all). You went to school and training for so many years. There is some level of pride and meaning you likely find in your work as a result of all that accumulated knowledge and hard work. The benefit of being FI is that you can take more risks: working part time, taking on other investment opportunities such as real estate, some people actually work MORE after FI but in an endeavor they really love like your own business (may be unrelated to medicine). You may save more by not paying for disability/life insurance. You can also take less risk with your investments (decrease your exposure to stocks, don't invest on margin). You can stop doing unpleasant parts of your job/life such as admin work (hire), housework (outsource), cooking (eat out more). Lots of things you can do once you hit FI without retiring early.

Not that I plan to have kids, but at this point it's so expensive that it literally makes more sense for one partner to stay home for that 6 years unless they are a professional. Like, my wife wouldn't even make enough to cover childcare expenses so it would be pointless for her to even bother working.

 

[finalpsychyear]

I'm hoping to be done around 48, but I'm starting my attending career around a decade later than most

Since your not planning kids you should be set even with the latter start. Heck if i didn't have plans to have at least 2 kids and have to consider college/grad school/weddings/larger house/nanny/maybe priv schools etc which I am not saying I will pay 100% but that's a decade right there of work that I would probably wipe off my table. I'd be dancing my way into the end of 2025.

 

[Merovinge]

Except game over is around mid 40s for me. At that point I really only want to work to pay my expenses and max out 401k. 2-3 days/wk or 25 ish hours. Or once i feel the burden of retirement savings pressure lifted by 2025 I may simply drop to 40 hrs and start investing in other things to diversify since the market is really the only thing so far. I also have a strong urge to try and just mostly pay off my future house in the next 3 years but i think that's a psychological achievement and not the best use of capital.

I have found working out and playing tennis which is a big hobby of mine again was really all I was missing maybe didn't realize how much it kept things in balance. The housing hunt is truly annoying so that's been time consuming. Fingers crossed that's figure out in 4-6 wks.

I know two couples, both with atleast 1 MD in the couple who spent 3-4 years looking at around 100 houses each. You just aren't going to find the absolutely perfect house at the perfect price so make sure you are willing to have the non-negotiables and then snag a pad!

 

[finalpsychyear]

I know two couples, both with atleast 1 MD in the couple who spent 3-4 years looking at around 100 houses each. You just aren't going to find the absolutely perfect house at the perfect price so make sure you are willing to have the non-negotiables and then snag a pad!

that's insane. Im not that picky. Been only 4 wks on the hunt. Bothers me when houses are marked up 50-80 percent from 2019 prices. Already seeing a slowdown in my area. Part of me feels it's only going to continue at least that's what i am seeing with 6 percent interest and possible recession. Shouldn't have to spend close to 1m to get a house no older than 10 years, 3500-4k sq feet not counting basement in midwest IMO. These houses went for 500-600k and part of me doubts they hold their value. Also the 1m is not going to be 2m anytime soon so it would be different if i was in an area sorta like that. median housing price is like 600k in my area right now.

 

[forchinet121]

that's insane. Im not that picky. Been only 4 wks on the hunt. Bothers me when houses are marked up 50-80 percent from 2019 prices. Already seeing a slowdown in my area. Part of me feels it's only going to continue at least that's what i am seeing with 6 percent interest and possible recession. Shouldn't have to spend close to 1m to get a house no older than 10 years, 3500-4k sq feet not counting basement in midwest IMO. These houses went for 500-600k and part of me doubts they hold their value. Also the 1m is not going to be 2m anytime soon so it would be different if i was in an area sorta like that. median housing price is like 600k in my area right now.

I thought you already found a house you liked? You didn’t make an offer?

 

[clozareal]

I know two couples, both with atleast 1 MD in the couple who spent 3-4 years looking at around 100 houses each. You just aren't going to find the absolutely perfect house at the perfect price so make sure you are willing to have the non-negotiables and then snag a pad!

100 houses??? like they went to 100 open houses or they looked at 100 places on Redfin? They need a much better realtor who can get them in early, get off market deals, and be more efficient with the process.

 

[Merovinge]

100 houses??? like they went to 100 open houses or they looked at 100 places on Redfin? They need a much better realtor who can get them in early, get off market deals, and be more efficient with the process.

No, like they physically went to 100 houses between open houses and private showings with realtors (over 3-5 years). There was clear indecision and higher than reasonable standards being applied in both cases, just a cautionary tale. Both couples profoundly reasonable and high achieving by any metric otherwise, houses just can make people do weird stuff.

 

[finalpsychyear]

I thought you already found a house you liked? You didn’t make an offer?

Was not willing to pay 100k more than the house on the same street which was bigger which sold recently when interest rates were even lower.

 

[TexasPhysician]

No, like they physically went to 100 houses between open houses and private showings with realtors (over 3-5 years). There was clear indecision and higher than reasonable standards being applied in both cases, just a cautionary tale. Both couples profoundly reasonable and high achieving by any metric otherwise, houses just can make people do weird stuff.

Seems excessive. My spouse and I have very different criteria. I care about location, a good deal, and how the space works. My spouse only cares about the charm and how cute it is. A lot of that can be determined by Google maps and Zillow though.

 

[dozitgetchahi]

What @Bartelby said. Chill. Relax. Cut back. Live some. Can't take the money to your grave. Be there for your kids or future kids. Otherwise, if you aren't the risks of them growing up to be little scats that blow all their inheritance on blow is higher. Get a better balance, stop focusing on the money saved.

Agreed. Cut back. I burned out hard during fellowship and I’ve made a major point of making sure my life is healthier and more pleasant going forward.

I’ll leave you with a quote from Seneca (from the legendary essay On the Shortness of Life):

It is inevitable that life will be not just very short but very miserable for those who acquire by great toil what they must keep by greater toil. They achieve what they want laboriously; they possess what they have achieved anxiously; and meanwhile they take no account of time that will never more return. New preoccupations take the place of the old, hope excites more hope and ambition more ambition. They do not look for an end to their misery, but simply change the reason for it.