These poor kids......and their futures

[sozetone]

At this point it is very clear that the job market cannot support pharmacists anymore. With the cost of tuition being what it is, I just dont understand how this continues year after year. And they get so excited about academia...talking about how they got accepted! and passed this and that......and in the end i know whats in store for them. I just feel so bad. I wish there was a way to show them like a Christmas carol or something ya know? lol...but serious...by 2023---2025 these guys will be backed into a corner man.....these schools and professional organizations make me sick to the pit of my stomach. I'm glad i never gave APHA any money or donations.....Seems like now all pharmacy wants in MORE money for everything..... notice that? get this certifications now!! get your MTM, opioid crisis cert now! huge fees for license and transfers...how about a job to pay for all this educational investment ?,Everybody has a hand in and grabbing some pie, and the poor pharmacist is drowning.....just plain dumb..ok im done ranting...

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[VA77]

I have talked 6 students out of pharmacy including my neice who is doing PA school this fall. I am trying to be a sounding board to all the lies that have been put out by the schools.

 

[Twentytwelve2]

advanced pharmacist certification. so you can do the same thing and have the title to go with it

 

[Sine Cura]

These are putative adults making livelihood decisions, not kids.

 

[SoylentGreen]

I feel bad for the people who signed on when we didn't see this coming and now have to deal with this situation. My sympathy is limited for those who think they know better than all of the working pharmacists who are telling them to run away now.

 

[King2440]

And I feel bad that I precept them but just had 2 IPPEs come through. 1 was
good and 1 not so good. They saw these WM cuts first hand with me. I tried to tell them to quit while they were ahead but it was a no go.

On another topic, it seems that pharmacy experience isn’t required anymore to get into pharmacy school...As they say just a pulse and $250K.

 

[sozetone]

These are putative adults making livelihood decisions, not kids.

Their growth is stunted from the digital world they grow up in. Constant facebook, twitter, iphones, ipods....etc causes psychological under-development. You cant learn about human emotion and interactions that way. not properly.....only through an Empoji...lol. i'm not really laughing out loud either.....see what im saying. I think you have to TRULY interact and experience life through your own eyes to adapt to the world, learn coping skills, how to laugh, love, cry, hurt, ...etc. So mentally, they are behind.

 

[Timbo]

We are doing good work online. The pre-pharmacy forums here is essentially dead other than the occasional post about someone reconsidering their pursuit of pharmacy. Schools are getting less applicants and they're getting desperate. I heard of one school rejecting only one applicant this cycle - they're essentially letting anybody in to fill their seats. Now we are left with those who never check online forums or research the job market before committing themselves to a $200k degree.

 

[sozetone]

We are doing good work online. The pre-pharmacy forums here is essentially dead other than the occasional post about someone reconsidering their pursuit of pharmacy. Schools are getting less applicants and they're getting desperate. I heard of one school rejecting only one applicant this cycle - they're essentially letting anybody in to fill their seats. Now we are left with those who never check online forums or research the job market before committing themselves to a $200k degree.

I bet that applicant was like jeffrey Dahmer or something too! .....

 

[peteronfireee]

I have talked 6 students out of pharmacy including my neice who is doing PA school this fall. I am trying to be a sounding board to all the lies that have been put out by the schools.

you're the real hero.

we need to start a riot or something. start burning couches

 

[PharmtoCS]

They have been warned of the saturation for years. They knew or should have known the risks. When we tell them to run, some of them even respond with hostility toward us for giving good advice and telling the truth.

They need to lay in the bed they make. No one stuck a gun to their heads to their heads for them to do pharmacy.

 

[8turkeys]

Applications are dropping fast, 3 years give or take and only 10k will be applying at the rate they are dropping

 

[mentos]

They have been warned of the saturation for years. They knew or should have known the risks. When we tell them to run, some of them even respond with hostility toward us for giving good advice and telling the truth.

They need to lay in the bed they make. No one stuck a gun to their heads to their heads for them to do pharmacy.

But it's their passion!

 

[gwarm01]

They have been warned of the saturation for years. They knew or should have known the risks. When we tell them to run, some of them even respond with hostility toward us for giving good advice and telling the truth.

They need to lay in the bed they make. No one stuck a gun to their heads to their heads for them to do pharmacy.

No kidding. I was aware of and worried about saturation when I went to pharmacy school a decade ago. There's no excuse to be ignorant of the job market in 2019. It shows a complete lack of effort to research your future career.

 

[sozetone]

But it's their passion!

Thats so funny, if you ask them what that means and to articulate/expound on the meaning of "passion for pharmacy" , they simply cant....just a blank stare....so true.

 

[projektreverb]

I would say “so you have a passion for counting by 5s and getting yelled at by people?”

 

[sozetone]

I would say “so you have a passion for counting by 5s and getting yelled at by people?”

and constantly being on edge that your job is getting slashed, leaving you broke because you sent all your money to the loan company...in a futile effort to pay it off. lol.

 

[AM77]

What else can you do when people take out a $200K loan for a sports car (pharmacy school) that they never test drove? We kept telling them that it’s a tough job market out there but it just falls on deaf ears.

 

[sozetone]

What else can you do when people take out a $200K loan for a sports car (pharmacy school) that they never test drove? We kept telling them that it’s a tough job market out there but it just falls on deaf ears.

They are just young and dont understand the world today, remember most of these kids have been glued to their phones with very little emotional and physical interaction. they are a whole new generation we simply cant understand.....i dont think they understand themselves.....lol

 

[PharmtoCS]

They are just young and dont understand the world today, remember most of these kids have been glued to their phones with very little emotional and physical interaction. they are a whole new generation we simply cant understand.....i dont think they understand themselves.....lol

A lot of them have been raised on participation trophies and naturally think that they’re superstars when all they had to do is to show up and do the bare minimum. After all, it has worked for them all the way through getting admitted to pharmacy schools with 2.5 GPA and 30 PCAT. They think that they can land their unicorn job in their desired saturated area using this approach.

They have not yet faced the real world where there is hard work and sacrifice without reward and punishment without actual wrongdoing.

 

[Saiyo]

You see it in the class threads. Everyone keeping their heads down about the elephant in the room, excited about getting interviews and acceptances with no fear of the future. It seems like they have the mindset that they will worry about it in the future after they graduate. I know this, because I was in the same position and had the same thoughts 9 years ago.

 

[Lubeckd]

A lot of them have been raised on participation trophies and naturally think that they’re superstars when all they had to do is to show up and do the bare minimum. After all, it has worked for them all the way through getting admitted to pharmacy schools with 2.5 GPA and 30 PCAT. They think that they can land their unicorn job in their desired saturated area using this approach.

They have not yet faced the real world where there is hard work and sacrifice without reward and punishment without actual wrongdoing.

generation z or millennials? a lot of Americans are entitled and have a lot of narcissism

 

[projektreverb]

generation z or millennials? a lot of Americans are entitled and have a lot of narcissism

But muh entitlements

 

[allantois]

generation z or millennials? a lot of Americans are entitled and have a lot of narcissism

Especially those boomers

 

[Twentytwelve2]

and constantly being on edge that your job is getting slashed, leaving you broke because you sent all your money to the loan company...in a futile effort to pay it off. lol.

This is my biggest worry. Say you pay off your loans then get a mortage for a home. Job gone or pay cut = foreclosure and stressed out.

 

[Hels2007]

This is my biggest worry. Say you pay off your loans then get a mortage for a home. Job gone or pay cut = foreclosure and stressed out.

Mortgage is WAY worse than student loans. There is no deferment or forbearance, and it makes moving away for another job opportunity more difficult. I never used to worry about losing my job when I only had student loans (and I had gone through a layoff during that time). Now I worry quite a bit, because I do have a house and a mortgage. The fact that my mortgage was five times the amount of all the student loans I have ever had makes it worse.

 

[mentos]

Mortgage is WAY worse than student loans. There is no deferment or forbearance, and it makes moving away for another job opportunity more difficult. I never used to worry about losing my job when I only had student loans (and I had gone through a layoff during that time). Now I worry quite a bit, because I do have a house and a mortgage. The fact that my mortgage was five times the amount of all the student loans I have ever had makes it worse.

Sounds like you paid too much for your house. You can easily sell it and get your equity back plus profit, the market is hot. Can't sell your brain to pay off student loans.

 

[sozetone]

This is my biggest worry. Say you pay off your loans then get a mortage for a home. Job gone or pay cut = foreclosure and stressed out.

Exactly man, exactly, you cant even settle down anymore. EVERY company has dropped salaries, which means by deductive logic, they realize what they are able to pay a pharmacist as of now, right? So the NEXT logical step is to carefully, skillfully, and without opening up to lawsuits, get the current population of pharmacists out. There is no way they are willing to keep paying 65, 70, 75/hr much longer.....not when they know they can pay 50 or less. And then guess what?......they will drop again, and continue the cycle. Most companies are achieving this through stright up legal lay-offs, but hidden under the surface is movement towards goals you cannot reach. They are setting this generation of pharms up for failure. little by little, pharms will drop out (burnout) or get fired, as we see happening every day....until the system finds a balance.....if that ever happens....lol. Look around and do the research, it's all happening now......just open your eyes.

 

[PharmtoCS]

generation z or millennials? a lot of Americans are entitled and have a lot of narcissism

Probably millennials a bit more than Generation Z. The latter is younger with probably even less real world experience but seems to be more pragmatic since they grew up during the Great Recession when their families did not have as much wealth as their millennial counterparts during the boom through the late 90's. They also see their millennial counterparts get into astronomical student debt with poor job prospects so more of them are forgoing higher education or at the very least being more selective of their career choices.

Millennials have the deadly combo of being entitled and idealistic which leads to more students taking out $200k+ in loans for devalued degrees despite data suggesting against doing so.

 

[Lubeckd]

Probably millennials a bit more than Generation Z. The latter is younger with probably even less real world experience but seems to be more pragmatic since they grew up during the Great Recession when their families did not have as much wealth as their millennial counterparts during the boom through the late 90's. They also see their millennial counterparts get into astronomical student debt with poor job prospects so more of them are forgoing higher education or at the very least being more selective of their career choices.

Millennials have the deadly combo of being entitled and idealistic which leads to more students taking out $200k+ in loans for devalued degrees despite data suggesting against doing so.

well millennials are special, and everyone gets a trophy. Even the boomers are entitled to free things

 

[projektreverb]

well millennials are special, and everyone gets a trophy. Even the boomers are entitled to free things

Entitled boomers are the worst. Imagine what will happen when entitled millennials become old, annoying farts.

 

[APN-59 rph]

Exactly man, exactly, you cant even settle down anymore. EVERY company has dropped salaries, which means by deductive logic, they realize what they are able to pay a pharmacist as of now, right? So the NEXT logical step is to carefully, skillfully, and without opening up to lawsuits, get the current population of pharmacists out. There is no way they are willing to keep paying 65, 70, 75/hr much longer.....not when they know they can pay 50 or less. And then guess what?......they will drop again, and continue the cycle. Most companies are achieving this through stright up legal lay-offs, but hidden under the surface is movement towards goals you cannot reach. They are setting this generation of pharms up for failure. little by little, pharms will drop out (burnout) or get fired, as we see happening every day....until the system finds a balance.....if that ever happens....lol. Look around and do the research, it's all happening now......just open your eyes.

It is likely to be worse than that as video linking to satellite locations gets up and running....A couple of techs run the place and you supervise from the mother ship.....What was 4 spots goes to one or two at home plate (two if they need extra help under the new system...)

 

[sozetone]

It is likely to be worse than that as video linking to satellite locations gets up and running....A couple of techs run the place and you supervise from the mother ship.....What was 4 spots goes to one or two at home plate (two if they need extra help under the new system...)

I think I'm starting to get "THE FEAR".......lol

 

[sozetone]

Mortgage is WAY worse than student loans. There is no deferment or forbearance, and it makes moving away for another job opportunity more difficult. I never used to worry about losing my job when I only had student loans (and I had gone through a layoff during that time). Now I worry quite a bit, because I do have a house and a mortgage. The fact that my mortgage was five times the amount of all the student loans I have ever had makes it worse.

Yep, the jobs are not sustainable over time. So you know your going to have to move to keep employed.......thats aweful. Ya cant keep moving your wife and kids all over the country because your job sucks. My wife came with me to colorado from florida 2 years ago and she does not want to keep bouncing state to state, and neither do i!

 

[doubletwenty]

This happened in Minnesota offically today.

Lunds & Byerlys exits the pharmacy business

Once seen as a benefit, pharmacies are now a bust for some grocery chains as fees increase and reimbursement rates drop.

www.grocerydive.com

 

[Gombrich12]

This happened in Minnesota offically today.

Lunds & Byerlys exits the pharmacy business

Once seen as a benefit, pharmacies are now a bust for some grocery chains as fees increase and reimbursement rates drop.

www.grocerydive.com

I imagine we'll be seeing a lot of struggling grocery chains closing their pharmacies in the coming years. Grocery is ruthless and Aldi and other discount grocers are expanding at high rates.

 

[sozetone]

This happened in Minnesota offically today.

Lunds & Byerlys exits the pharmacy business

Once seen as a benefit, pharmacies are now a bust for some grocery chains as fees increase and reimbursement rates drop.

www.grocerydive.com

What do you forsee for publix pharmacy? they are a nice chain in the southeast, a few up north.....i used to work for them. Despicable people.....i know they are struggling hardcore.

 

[sozetone]

As another Trump administration policy falls, eyes turn to Congress for DIR reform

With all executive avenues seemingly blocked, a pharmacy community hungry for relief from retroactive DIR fees now turns to Congress for action. The CMS proposed rule would have applied to 2020 Part D plans. “We expected or hoped that the CMS action would be the route that would finally...

pharmacist.com

This does not help either........lol

 

[doubletwenty]

I imagine it might take some time for them to close down. The future is uncertain. No grocery supermarkets are safe. Heard some Lunds stores were doing 1200 prescriptions a week, and they still closed down, at least the pharmacy portion. So, you never know.