Question for practicing dentists

[IllegalSeal]

This is my first post here on SDN, and it is a question that has always intrigued me. I am not specifically asking how much money any specialty makes, however I am curious about the dental GPR hospital residencies. I am considering hopefully going into OMFS down the road as I love the field, but I also love general dentistry. The only differing factor in my eyes is the difference in salary at this point. From personal experience with my uncle who is a general dentist working three days a week in a private practice, he pulls somewhere in the range of 500k a year, and my aunt who is an OMFS pulls about 600-650k a year in a group practice working 5 days a week. My uncle is only doing crown and bridge procedures mainly, and my aunt predominantly does wisdom teeth, general extractions, and implants. My main question is that if a general dentist were to do a hospital based GPR residency after dental school and become certified to do procedures under general anesthesia, along with doing implants, wisdom teeth, extractions, endo, perio, and of course general procedures such as crown and bridge along with other cosmetic restorative procedures. Would a general dentist of that nature and working a full 5 days a week not conceivably be able to make significantly more than a practicing OMFS? Also considering the fact that most oral surgeons only do procedures in the mornings, while GP's are cranking them out all day long.

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[Craig_Sherwood234]

Lol

 

[amariesa]

SDN is the home for a lot of pre-dents, and dental students who cant answer this question for you. Although there are some dentists here, they moved to other forums (I believe its called dentaltown or something). I would talk to your family first and get their opinion on the money side of things and if you aren't satisfied, ask there.

 

[321931]

Income, Billing and Other Common Dentistry Statistics

179k average for general dentist
320k average for a specialist.

These numbers are straight from the American Dental Association. Any other questions?

 

[JLT223]

My main question is that if a general dentist were to do a hospital based GPR residency after dental school and become certified to do procedures under general anesthesia, along with doing implants, wisdom teeth, extractions, endo, perio, and of course general procedures such as crown and bridge along with other cosmetic restorative procedures

If you kill somebody under IV sedation, fracture their jaw while pulling third molars, or injure a neurovascular bundle, you'll be held to the same standards as an OMFS even if you're a GP. Telling the judge "But I took a weekend CE course" won't save you.

 

[IllegalSeal]

If you kill somebody under IV sedation, fracture their jaw while pulling third molars, or injure a neurovascular bundle, you'll be held to the same standards as an OMFS even if you're a GP. Telling the judge "But I took a weekend CE course" won't save you.

I completely understand what you're saying, but isn't that the purpose of a GPR residency is to do hospital dentistry rotations? Everywhere I have read seems to give the understanding that these residencies train you completely for these procedures including hospital level anesthesia. I might be wrong but that is what I understand these residencies to be. If so wouldn't that be far more substantial than saying "oh I took a weekend CE course"?

 

[IllegalSeal]

Income, Billing and Other Common Dentistry Statistics

179k average for general dentist
320k average for a specialist.

These numbers are straight from the American Dental Association. Any other questions?

I get that those are the numbers from the ADA, but I have specifically seen the checks and tax returns from my uncle. I can vouch that it is a fact the man takes home 500k as a general practitioner from working 3 days per week. I am simply curious if as a GP who goes through GPR residency and does general dentistry as well as all of the cash cow procedures that an oral Surgeon makes their living off of could theoretically wind up making more than an OMS makes?

 

[321931]

I completely understand what you're saying, but isn't that the purpose of a GPR residency is to do hospital dentistry rotations? Everywhere I have read seems to give the understanding that these residencies train you completely for these procedures including hospital level anesthesia. I might be wrong but that is what I understand these residencies to be. If so wouldn't that be far more substantial than saying "oh I took a weekend CE course"?

Doesn't matter. If a GP has years of experience and anything happens during OS, they will be held accountable to the standard of a OS and they will 99.9% lose.

To the normal person on a jury trial and they bring in expert OMFS witnesses against a GP....you have no chance.

 

[321931]

I get that those are the numbers from the ADA, but I have specifically seen the checks and tax returns from my uncle. I can vouch that it is a fact the man takes home 500k as a general practitioner from working 3 days per week. I am simply curious if as a GP who goes through GPR residency and does general dentistry as well as all of the cash cow procedures that an oral Surgeon makes their living off of could theoretically wind up making more than an OMS makes?

That's nice. I know old timers that also make that kind of money.

The problem is they started in the 80's,90's,00's. The era that you are entering is much different. Good luck.

 

[IllegalSeal]

Doesn't matter. If a GP has years of experience and anything happens during OS, they will be held accountable to the standard of a OS and they will 99.9% lose.

To the normal person on a jury trial and they bring in expert OMFS witnesses against a GP....you have no chance.

Okay that makes sense. So logically even if you are trained to do these types of procedures through a residency as a GP it wouldn't be the smartest idea to do so?

 

[IllegalSeal]

That's nice. I know old timers that also make that kind of money.

The problem is they started in the 80's,90's,00's. The era that you are entering is much different. Good luck.

Well what I am curious about is that when I get through D school, the practice my uncle is running would be sold to me and so I was wondering if I were to basically do exactly what he is doing at the moment to make the living he does but also upping the work to 5 days a week and adding the other cash cow procedures that he doesn't do at all would that not lend itself to end up making far more of an income than he is producing at the moment?

 

[321931]

Well what I am curious about is that when I get through D school, the practice my uncle is running would be sold to me and so I was wondering if I were to basically do exactly what he is doing at the moment to make the living he does but also upping the work to 5 days a week and adding the other cash cow procedures that he doesn't do at all would that not lend itself to end up making far more of an income than he is producing at the moment?

Yes. It could be a a gold mine with all the "cash cow" procedures. I love that word "cash cow." Good luck!

 

[JLT223]

Okay that makes sense. So logically even if you are trained to do these types of procedures through a residency as a GP it wouldn't be the smartest idea to do so?

You do what you can comfortably handle. If there are complications or you foresee any, you better refer. Tons of GPs do their own molar endo or perio, but when an issue arises, they refer out. A GPR is to increase your efficacy and ability to perform general dentistry. You will be nowhere as competent as somebody who spends 4-6+ years doing solely oral surgery. You'll gain a small sliver of that knowledge in a hospital based program. Hope this helps.

 

[IllegalSeal]

You do what you can comfortably handle. If there are complications or you foresee any, you better refer. Tons of GPs do their own molar endo or perio, but when an issue arises, they refer out. A GPR is to increase your efficacy and ability to perform general dentistry. You will be nowhere as competent as somebody who spends 4-6+ years doing solely oral surgery. You'll gain a small sliver of that knowledge in a hospital based program. Hope this helps.

Thanks so much, I really appreciate the knowledge!

 

[IllegalSeal]

Yes. It could be a a gold mine with all the "cash cow" procedures. I love that word "cash cow." Good luck!

Also my uncle has 9 back staff, 3 front rooms, and four back procedural rooms. He actually only uses two of the back rooms as he is one man and can't work all four at once haha. Do you think once I get to the point of taking over that practice that it would be more beneficial and much more profitable to do all of the previously described things but with two docs instead of one? As in if I were to bring in a buddy to work with me who would do the same stuff + cash cow procedures and IV sedation at 5 days a week? Or would having to split returns with another doc's salary (partner not associate) greatly reduce my returns? Again I know it's not about money and I love this field but these are some logistical things I have been curious about!