so many separated student clubs at Ross.

[NewDragon]

On campus, there are muslim, latin american students associations.

However, there are at least five SEPARATE asian groups! While the latin group keep sending me junk mails about information on "promoting" their cultures, I see that Asians are living in their own secluded shells.

how can I get myself off that latin list, because I have seen enough "promoting" of their cultures. They teach spanish classes for free, but they forgot that while that is a part of their "culture," spanish is merely a Master's language, meaning, it is a language from Spain which colonized most parts of latin America. So spanish is really not a part of the latin american culture at all. It is just a matter of who came first. So I don't see why those latin americans are clinging on that part of language root so hard.

back to my original topic, while latin americans are bonding tightly, they came from different countries. and they have their own cultures, however, they were able to form just one uniform club.

however, Asians are all separated into mini clubs. And they use names such as Chinese student, vietnamese student, etc, etc. I doubt that many of them actually have passports from those countries. they all have US passports, but they forgot the alligance that they performed during the naturalization ceremony. What a shame, US opens its heart to all the new immigrants, but in the end, they still think that they are not US citizens.

And just by looking at the campus of Ross, we know that those people are not really Americans.

And then they come around, and complain that even though they were born in the US, people still think that they are foreingers, and praise them for speaking english so well, etc, etc.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[pitman]

Originally posted by NewDragon
how can I get myself off that latin list, because I have seen enough "promoting" of their cultures. They teach spanish classes for free, but they forgot that while that is a part of their "culture," spanish is merely a Master's language, meaning, it is a language from Spain which colonized most parts of latin America. So spanish is really not a part of the latin american culture at all. It is just a matter of who came first. So I don't see why those latin americans are clinging on that part of language root so hard.

For the same reason that French is the primary language of many African nations, English is the language of the US, or even, say, all European, African and middle eastern languages are derived from now dead ones from Mesopotamia -- of course Spanish is part of their culture, it's just more recent than the hundreds of non-integrated dead languages spawned from Mesoamerica.

-pitman

 

[Meat Cookie]

What you're not seeing is that the common thread in each of these clubs is their native LANGUAGE. All Latin Americans speak Spanish regardless of what country they come from so they have one club...this is not true of Chinese, Vietnamese, etc. so they form their separate clubs so that members can get together and speak their common tongue. The "Asian" club that you suggest would require members to speak English, defeating the whole purpose.

 

[Stephen Ewen]

It is of course true that Spanish is not "native" to Latin America; yet, cultures are adaptive and Spanish is "native" there now. At the same time, there are threads of nativism in Latin America that reach back toward pre-colonialism.

Peoples' identities tend to be strongly tied to their language(s) and history(s), as even your post indicates for your own identity surrounding English and the U.S. Some of these are singular oriented, some are cosmopolitan.

Latin Americas tend to have a strong Pan Latin-American identity based upon much shared history and of course their shared language. The Asian cultures you mentioned do not have a shared language and their histories are not strongly shared, generally. This would naturally account for the grouping and non-grouping of the groups. Just because Latin Americans, Asians, and others, also speak English and are U.S. citizens does not mean they will, or should unless they choose to, find their cultural identities in English and the U.S. alone.

Love and learn of and from all, as far as you can.

 

[redshifteffect]

Originally posted by NewDragon
What a shame, US opens its heart to all the new immigrants, but in the end, they still think that they are not US citizens.

And just by looking at the campus of Ross, we know that those people are not really Americans.

And then they come around, and complain that even though they were born in the US, people still think that they are foreingers, and praise them for speaking english so well, etc, etc.

Yeah but the thing you don't realize is that the US doesn't open "hearts" for free..they want skilled people to come and boost the ecconomy as well as invest more cash into the system. I'm pretty sure the US gets some advantage from these ppl. otherwise it wouldn't let them in.

If they choose to have a link to their former culture there is nothing wrong with that; it doesn't make them any less American.

 

[Bevo]

another reason for the spanish classes is that, if you ever get to the 5th semester preppy, that in miami a lot of the patients you will be seeing will only speak spanish. Probably more people in Miami speak spanish than english. Or at least their spanish is better than their english

So OLAS wants to help those people who do not speak the language to at least be able to interact in a limited fasion with patients you'll be seing in 5th semester and beyond. Spanish is probably the 2nd most spoken language in america now.

It can't hurt to know it.

 

[NewDragon]

Originally posted by Meat Cookie
What you're not seeing is that the common thread in each of these clubs is their native LANGUAGE. All Latin Americans speak Spanish regardless of what country they come from so they have one club...this is not true of Chinese, Vietnamese, etc. so they form their separate clubs so that members can get together and speak their common tongue. The "Asian" club that you suggest would require members to speak English, defeating the whole purpose.

Not really, there are lots of students who were born in the US, and some of them can not speak their "native" language at all. I doubt that many of them actually lived in their "native" countries. and I doubt that they will speak their "native" language during club meetings.

Besides, south americans have different cultures, too. If they can bound as one club, I don't see why Asians are so particularly into separated clubs.

And I am not saying that it is not ok for people in the US to form their own clubs, etc, etc. However, Ross U is a med. school, it is not an elementary school which you may have new immigrants, etc, etc. By the time, students get into Ross, they all can speak english, and most of them have all graduated from a four year college, have had enough of exposure of US cultures.

after graduation, they will meet people of all kinds. why do those students still cling to the old tradition, when it is time to be more open, and try to be more diverse.

 

[NewDragon]

Another thing is that since there are so many spanish speaking US citizens, spanish is the second language. but I don't like the fact that it seems that it is being forced upon all the others.

New immigrants already have tough time learning english, now sometimes, they were sort of forced to learn spanish. it is not fair to put spanish in the dominant place.

Originally posted by lmbebo
another reason for the spanish classes is that, if you ever get to the 5th semester preppy, that in miami a lot of the patients you will be seeing will only speak spanish. Probably more people in Miami speak spanish than english. Or at least their spanish is better than their english
It can't hurt to know it.

 

[pitman]

Originally posted by NewDragon
Another thing is that since there are so many spanish speaking US citizens, spanish is the second language. but I don't like the fact that it seems that it is being forced upon all the others.

New immigrants already have tough time learning english, now sometimes, they were sort of forced to learn spanish. it is not fair to put spanish in the dominant place.

I don't think there's any forcing going on, but certainly if you're going to serve in an area with many native Spanish speakers, then it would be in your own interest to learn some Spanish.

As for any policy solution to the problem you perceive here, you would be better served supporting US laws to teach primary education only in English, not with trying to dissuade foreign-tongued social groups. Unfortunately, California teachers' unions for example oppose such laws, probably b.c. the status quo favors current "specialized" bi-lingual educators.

-pitman

 

[NewDragon]

yes, sometimes, the spanish requirement is forced upon others. Many places at California, and probably at Florida, texas require that the applicant speaks spanish and english. well, it is fine and dandy for those who are white, black. but for many new immigrants, if they want to have jobs like that, they will have to learn two new languages.

and i have met a pure Chinese doctor who was born in the US, but he speaks spanish fluently. now those spanish speaking people want to teach others about "their" cultures and language, but in a way, others were forced to learn spanish directly and indirectly.

back to my original topic, i actually suggested to the president of one of the asian club on campus. since his club is open for all, why not change it to a more general name, but he doesn't think so. guess he would rather be a president of dominica than a president of australia.

i also think that those people who created those clubs with specific ethnic name attached to it are actually trying to compete with each other. that is not a good thing especially in medicine.

 

[lealf-ye]

One of the reasons that asians from different countries have their own clue is that they speak different language. Indian, Chinese, Korean and Japanese all have their own languages. They are not able to use their own languages if they only have one clue. One the other hand, latin Americans all speak spanish, so there is no problem of communication between them.

 

[NewDragon]

like i have said before, I have no problem of people speaking diff. languages forming their own clubs in the states. but we are talking about a professional school, every student speaks english.

why do those "intelligent" people want to form clubs by their own ethnic backgrounds?

then you hear them constantly whining about how "americans" think them as "foreigners." they created the problem themselves.
Even the local Dominicans are learning to differenciate now. If you are not white, you are just not "american."

 

[Stephen Ewen]

It is like I was trying to say before, ND. Peoples' very indentities are inter-wrapped very tightly with their culture and language. It is only natural that people with similar world and life views congregate in solidarity together.

To get more heady about it, you might have read the 18th century Emile Durkheim in a sociology or anthropology class in college. Speaking of solidairty forms, Durkheim argued that within the forms, members come to think correspondingly by internalizing and normalizing their conceptions of the social order. Members then project their conceptions out onto their larger world. Durkheim showed that, within a social order, there is a generally shared symbolic universe and classification of nature, and that those comprise the principles of authority and cooperation for a people. The social order thereby becomes moral and legitimate to them. So people naturally want to be around, at least some of the time, those who think about and view things most correspondingly.

Fact is, ALL people do this. You too. Me too. And it is just wonderful when groups reach out to others and say, in essence, "we welcome you to learn about and with us." Those experiences then can become part of both group's IDs and world and life views. Those who are all upset over lack of cultural and linguistic homogenization tend to radically miss this, and that the foremost condition neccessary for any measure of homogenization is differentiation itself.

 

[Stephen Ewen]

Originally posted by pitman
I don't think there's any forcing going on, but certainly if you're going to serve in an area with many native Spanish speakers, then it would be in your own interest to learn some Spanish.

http://www.vtmednet.org/medspanish/

 

[heart1st]

What do you call someone who speaks 3 languages...?

multilingual

What do you call someone who speaks 2 languages...?

bilingual

What do you call someone who speaks 1 language...?

American

Now, I really only speak 1 language (my recent 1 yr of Russian notwithstanding)...but the area I live in is one of the most integrated in San Jose. I have Mexican-American and Vietnamese neighbors. To not know another language, I think, is to be culturally ignorant; each language seems to provide its own mindset, it's own sensitivities. One friend of mine tells me her (Mexican-American) name as it is supposed to be said -- soft and lilting-- which makes our pronunciation sound harsh and vulgar. It's a sensitivity that you learn by listening to the music in other languages.

 

[NewDragon]

don't know if you people are agreeing with disagreeing with me.

I just think that it is not right for people who are already bilingual to learn to speak spanish just to get a job in the US. after all, English is supposed to be the national language.

and for those asians who form their own clubs by their own ethnic background in professional schools, i think that it is just plain wrong. at least, they should form a unified club like the latinos did.