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I know for certain several bullet points on that slide are demonstrably wrong
isn’t like Houston the most population dense area of TX. “All regions of TX except Houston area have a need for rad oncs.” So we need rad oncs… just not where there’s the most people. Try having that make good sense to a med student looking at rad onc vs say med onc, urology, etc.

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isn’t like Houston the most population dense area of TX. “All regions of TX except Houston area have a need for rad oncs.” So we need rad oncs… just not where there’s the most people. Try having that make good sense to a med student looking at rad onc vs say med onc, urology, etc.
"All regions of TX except Houston area have a need for rad oncs" is a very, very false statement.
 
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feel like I see pulm offering CT screening to pts a lot more in my neck of the woods than the PCPs do

This is just for HEDIS so it only matters for medicare and/or if your payer or employer track these measures and use them to make you do things. So this might make PCPs do it more.

It seems to me there has been a shift where culturally LCS is much more accepted than when I first started working on this at my job(s) 5 years ago. I know it is controversial but I think its a good thing for patients of lower SE status and states with heavy smoking.

Its also a slight good for Rad Onc. LCS programs consistently identify 2-4% of their cases as cancer and those patients seem to receive SBRT at least half the time, more in some systems.
 
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This is just for HEDIS so it only matters for medicare and/or if your payer or employer track these measures and use them to make you do things. So this might make PCPs do it more.

It seems to me there has been a shift where culturally LCS is much more accepted than when I first started working on this at my job(s) 5 years ago. I know it is controversial but I think its a good thing for patients of lower SE status and states with heavy smoking.

Its also a slight good for Rad Onc. LCS programs consistently identify 2-4% of their cases as cancer and those patients seem to receive SBRT at least half the time, more in some systems.
Absolutely. Many of these pts with terrible lungs can't even get biopsies in some cases, just document growth, pet fdg avidity and beam on if pulm feels bx too risky and CT surgery doesn't want to wedge
 
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Lol

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"Weather is great outside today, what climate change?"
 
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This is just for HEDIS so it only matters for medicare and/or if your payer or employer track these measures and use them to make you do things. So this might make PCPs do it more.

It seems to me there has been a shift where culturally LCS is much more accepted than when I first started working on this at my job(s) 5 years ago. I know it is controversial but I think its a good thing for patients of lower SE status and states with heavy smoking.

It’s also a slight good for Rad Onc. LCS programs consistently identify 2-4% of their cases as cancer and those patients seem to receive SBRT at least half the time, more in some systems.
The rising incidence of stage one is “causing” the falling incidence of stage III. Also one new stage one lung patient consult per week adds one patient per day on beam, but one stage III consult per week would add 6 patients per day on beam. All of this is to say, it is not clear that significantly more lung cancer patients are seen per year per rad onc today than 20 years ago even with a dramatic uptake in LCS, and some data shows less lung patients per day per rad onc under beam. This math is very interesting.
 
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Just to throw out there - I’ve treated a few stage IIIs picked up on screening
 
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isn’t like Houston the most population dense area of TX. “All regions of TX except Houston area have a need for rad oncs.” So we need rad oncs… just not where there’s the most people. Try having that make good sense to a med student looking at rad onc vs say med onc, urology, etc.

It’s about as intellectually honest as pointing to a color map of national election results county by county and concluding a “red wave”

There isn’t competition for work in the Austin, Dallas, and San Antonio metros? I don’t believe that.

Oh people don’t want to move their families to the border towns? Big shocker there.

Places like Abilene are going to struggle to recruit because they are not going to pay any significant premium over what MDACC does. That’s their problem.
 
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Just to throw out there - I’ve treated a few stage IIIs picked up on screening
As stage 3s or 1s?

I’ve seen a system that basically SBRTs anything remotely active on pet. Evaluating nodes and attempting biopsy? Nobody got time for that. Rad oncs eager to do it too. What was PPV of nodules picked up on the screening trials? Don’t ask questions…
 
One major chance that I am seeing among physicians in Europe is part-time work.
I am not exactly sure, why this is not a thing in the US (or maybe it is)?

There are even residents nowadays that will work only something like 60% or 80% of the normal week. And no, they are not mums or dads with kids home, they are people with "hobbies". They choose a longer residence and less pay, in exchange for more free time. Needless to say, they keep this up after they've finished residency too.

Is this less common in the US, especially in the generation of physicians that have finished residency recently?
 
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One major chance that I am seeing among physicians in Europe is part-time work.
I am not exactly sure, why this is not a thing in the US (or maybe it is)?

There are even residents nowadays that will work only something like 60% or 80% of the normal week. And no, they are not mums or dads with kids home, they are people with "hobbies". They choose a longer residence and less pay, in exchange for more free time. Needless to say, they keep this up after they've finished residency too.

Is this less common in the US, especially in the generation of physicians that have finished residency recently?
No, we see this too, except I think we're coming from different starting points. Doctors in the US worked long hours, and a "busy" radonc could have 40-60 patients on treatment. There are still some that do, but it's much rarer/less desired by new grads these days, especially since the potential reward is much lower.
 
One major chance that I am seeing among physicians in Europe is part-time work.
I am not exactly sure, why this is not a thing in the US (or maybe it is)?

There are even residents nowadays that will work only something like 60% or 80% of the normal week. And no, they are not mums or dads with kids home, they are people with "hobbies". They choose a longer residence and less pay, in exchange for more free time. Needless to say, they keep this up after they've finished residency too.

Is this less common in the US, especially in the generation of physicians that have finished residency recently?
Part time in America is still very sporadic. Mostly because of real and/or imagined supervision issues. As the real continues to become no longer real, and boogeyman stories lose their bite, part time will become much more common.
 
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Part time in America is still very sporadic. Mostly because of real and/or imagined supervision issues. As the real continues to become no longer real, and boogeyman stories lose their bite, part time will become much more common.

Any rad onc signing up for a solo practice at a rural hospital that requires 5 days on site while linac is on is doing it wrong at this point.
 
Part time in America is still very sporadic. Mostly because of real and/or imagined supervision issues. As the real continues to become no longer real, and boogeyman stories lose their bite, part time will become much more common.
Also the issue if tying full employment to insurance. Some places do not give same benefit to part time workers
 
As stage 3s or 1s?

I’ve seen a system that basically SBRTs anything remotely active on pet. Evaluating nodes and attempting biopsy? Nobody got time for that. Rad oncs eager to do it too. What was PPV of nodules picked up on the screening trials? Don’t ask questions…

its kind of wild how casually this is said but yet surprises none of us

there's some really ****ty cancer care out there.
 
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Oh for sure. It happens. But this is the trend:

View attachment 383182

Great figure.

Two things can be true. Its good to do lung screening and you can say it should generate and increase of about 2-5% in lung cancer diagnosis. Also that many of those patients get SBRT. An employed RO can impress their leadership by working on lung screening and it also is working on "something that increases center volumes".

Its also true that it's not going to save Rad Onc and people need to get to the acceptance phase of grieving on that. If we are over supplied, it just pressures screening programs to operate like this:

As stage 3s or 1s?

I’ve seen a system that basically SBRTs anything remotely active on pet. Evaluating nodes and attempting biopsy? Nobody got time for that. Rad oncs eager to do it too. What was PPV of nodules picked up on the screening trials? Don’t ask questions…

Its satisfying to reassure and observe a patient that doesn't need treatment, unless someone is yelling at you to "grow the practice".

If that chair guy would just learn about global warming... gah
 
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its kind of wild how casually this is said but yet surprises none of us

there's some really ****ty cancer care out there.
I got fed up seeing patients without tissue diagnosis and patients were told “biopsy could collapse your lung”

So cool. Maybe they can rewrite nccn guidelines.
 
I got fed up seeing patients without tissue diagnosis and patients were told “biopsy could collapse your lung”

So cool. Maybe they can rewrite nccn guidelines.
I discuss it with pulm and CT surgery. Most of the time they tend to be reasonable. A lot of areas are difficult to reach by ENB and when a pt has really bad bullous COPD it can be risky to hit one of those bullae.

I document the heck out of things including the pt consent and discussion of why we are skipping the bx, but if the rationale is sound and the imaging and clinical history fits I see no problems skipping the bx.

Supposedly in Japan, they skip bx quite often and they reportedly treat surgery and sbrt the same
 
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I discuss it with pulm and CT surgery. Most of the time they tend to be reasonable. A lot of areas are difficult to reach by ENB and when a pt has really bad bullous COPD it can be risky to hit one of those bullae.

I document the heck out of things including the pt consent and discussion of why we are skipping the bx, but if the rationale is sound and the imaging and clinical history fits I see no problems skipping the bx.

Supposedly in Japan, they skip bx quite often and they reportedly treat surgery and sbrt the same
Smoker, growth on consecutive CT scans, PET avid, relatively low-risk location.... BEAM ON!

Seriously, though. I have no qualms treating without biopsy if above factors met.
 
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I don’t think anyone has an issue with non-biopsy SBRT cases. The issue is when people are doing it on anything and everything without thinking, which is what I think MidwestRO was talking about
 
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Easier to collect rvus when you just sbrt everything that walks in the door.

Maybe it’s right sometimes maybe it’s not. But always easier that way. Literally never heard an answer for a lung nodule in tumor board with the question of “can you sbrt that?” with anything other than an enthusiastic YES I SURE CAN!
 
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The level of incompetence and corruption which permeates the deepest layers of our field is astounding.
 
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View attachment 383272

Can we make this an official ASTRO webinar? I'd go!

Oh wait - why not a plenary at this year's conference?

I'd actually pay the $7000 to register if that was on the schedule!

That's really asking a lot of ASTRO's regulatory team to make them suppress a session each year from the ASTRO on-demand content.
 
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In all seriousness, I'm a hypocrite wrt my previous post, though I don't ever say "need.". Otoh, I'm batting 1.000 when it comes to treating the breast that had cancer in it.
 
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You know what I'm gonna go ahead and say it - I'd rather that patient receive adjuvant APBI with the Livi protocol than hormone therapy.
That wasn't what my meme was suggesting! I love the Livi treatment.
OTOH, the purpose of endocrine therapy is not exclusively local control. ABPI is (in that patient population). Will the ultimate LC and OS differ in either group? I doubt it, regardless of the different mechanism.
 
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That wasn't what my meme was suggesting! I love the Livi treatment.
OTOH, the purpose of endocrine therapy is not exclusively local control. ABPI is (in that patient population). Will the ultimate LC and OS differ in either group? I doubt it, regardless of the different mechanism.
Exactly. If practicing best evidence based medicine in a T1N0 ER+ elderly breast cancer case, a rad onc should oversee AT MOST 5 days of wrong site treatment.
 
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