MD Is UFAPs a scam?

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Damm, I thought I was reasonably intelligent. I wonder if that's what all my friends think of me in other engineering think of me. A dumb robot that memorizes

1. No because general public and many of intellectual elite do not quite know what med school is really like

2. You could be. Med school just will not test that, so your performance is a poor indicator of intellectually gifted you truly are.

3. Who cares. Do this job because you like treating patients while doing pretty well financially in a mostly recession proof job that garners decent societal respect.

4. If you care...there are verifiably good ways to figure out who is a genius physician down the line (patents, consistent elite pubs, doing well in medicine but having a transferrable skill set to other fields as well and applying them aka Atul Gawande).

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1. No because general public and many of intellectual elite do not quite know what med school is really like

2. You could be. Med school just will not test that, so your performance is a poor indicator of intellectually gifted you truly are.

3. Who cares. Do this job because you like treating patients while doing pretty well financially in a mostly recession proof job that garners decent societal respect.

4. There are verifiably good ways to figure out who is a genius physician down the line (patents, consistent elite pubs, doing well in medicine but having a transferrable skill set to other fields as well and applying them aka Atul Gawande).
Wow, you have bit of a cynical look on things. I did reasonable well in my undergrad math, physics and organic chemistry classes (All As). Granted, there not at the highest level you could take. Does that change things? Also, What made you want you to get a MD instead of a PhD?
 
Wow, you have bit of a cynical look on things. I did reasonable well in my undergrad math, physics and organic chemistry classes (All As). Granted, there not at the highest level you could take. Does that change things? Also, What made you want you to get a MD instead of a PhD?

I like sitting there and BSing with people and hearing about their lives and stories. I'm one of those people that can waste days just sitting at a table discussing random stuff with all sorts of people. Clinical medicine offers that.

I like hearing different views, perspectives, stories, ideas, and also observing different emotions, relationships, and just general interactions. It's a job where you learn a lot about humanity and your humanity.

Are you asking me to assess you in some way? I cannot do that. I don't know you well enough. Also, you shouldn't take my opinion seriously enough to consider that. I'm some random dude on the interwebz. You don't need my validation.
 
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I like sitting there and BSing with people and hearing about their lives and stories. I'm one of those people that can waste days just sitting at a table discussing random stuff with all sorts of people. Clinical medicine offers that.

I like hearing different views, perspectives, stories, ideas, and also observing different emotions, relationships, and just general interactions. It's a job where you learn a lot about humanity and your humanity.

Are you asking me to assess you in some way? I cannot do that. I don't know you well enough. Also, you shouldn't take my opinion seriously enough to consider that. I'm some random dude on the interwebz. You don't need my validation.
I getcha. I'm just trying to figure out how people view me and what I do from the outside
 
I was probably bottom 30% of my class preclinical and got a 257 on step 1. P=md method helped free time to memorize pathoma and sketchy (and sleep 8+ hrs a night).

I think it’s all about learning styles and self-motivation. If you are self motivated and learn on your own, then that p=md formula can help you crush step 1.

The fact that step 1 performance correlates positively with preclinical performance does not imply a causal relationship. I know anecdotes are not the best evidence either, but I do think it’s highly individualized. Be honest and ask how you best study and if your school’s curriculum is trash or high yield.
 
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My dude. I was joking. It was a joke. Hence the no fun at parties.
Youre wrong. Kaplan doesnt just test minutiae. Their physio Qs are extremely creative and many people agree with me.
Every QBank tests minutiae. Uworld does it too, and they get away with it bc theyre so widely regarded.
Well, consider me silly for not picking up on a one line "joke" post...It's pretty easy to tell in person when people are joking, even sarcastically, but you must be the wizard of all things fun and entertaining.

Like I said earlier, probably some of our disagreement stems from how we differently define minutiae. I think a certain level of discrete fact knowledge is required and not necessarily minutiae, which is much more what UWorld incorporates whereas Kaplan typically went beyond this. Regarding "Many people agree with me" we know that's not a real argument either; in Psychiatry many people believe "circumstantial" speech is correct in place of "circumferential" speech, but that doesn't mean they're right. Not a great tool to make a point, in general.

Anyway, you seem very invested in this whole thread. I'm not. I agree that Kaplan has utility; my opinion is to use it in MS1/2 before dedicated (which is what I did).
 
Uworld is king
Sketchy is the king’s sword
Pathoma is the trusty steed
Anki is a wizard, the king’s ally
USMLE-RX is the baseborn son
Kaplan is the treacherous noble
FA is a map of the kingdom...

...and your school’s lectures are the kingdom.
 
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M0 here, starting in the fall. Dipping my fit into the Medical students forums after living in the pre-med environment for a year. This is intense... :))) hahahhaha.

So, can i highjack the post for a sec, - on topic though. So whats the best way to approach the step prep? during 1.5 years focus hard on courses, maybe occasionally flip through step prep for specific topics you are covering in class, and then after fall semester of M2 study for step? would that work? or do you think the prep for step should be spread throughout 2 years?
 
just do zanki all day and memorize u world and you can score high enough not to barred from any specialty. that's all that matters. don't over complicate it. i did more "thinking" in my general physics 1 class than all of med school combined. ask a med student to explain why doppler tests for sickle cell patients looked for higher velocity in a narrowed arterial lumen. many will falsely cite poiseuille's law, if they cite anything, and be largely mistaken and not see the contradiction.

you don't have to deeply understand squat. I went from scoring 30th percentile my first year to 70 percentile my 2nd year (I calculated these based on means and SDs at my mid tier school that releases those after every exam but I go to a pure pass fail school), to 82 percentile on STEP1, to honoring all my clerkships with scores all in the 99th percentile on shelves (only exception was OB which was 95th and surgery which was 80th and barely honored because these were first couple clerkships) by changing my entire strategy to just doing thousands of flash cards and memorizing u world by high lighting stuff i didn't know and rerereading it a bunch of times. yeah sometimes i dabbled with goljan and devirgilios but looking back those were largely padding to make me "feel" more secure. When i saw shelf questions, I literally recalled the card and table that had the answer in it.

this **** is mostly glorified recall. btw at my mid tier school, we had some 260s and 270s applying to competitive **** get **** on and go to lower tier programs than people with 240s and 250s. it was obvious which personality types were hated on (think introvert, poor vocabulary and sentence structure, lacking in charisma, inability to think on the spot with weird questions because their minds were robotically setup only to cram facts and regurgitate...srs not srs... etc.)

Kaplan believe it or not has some of the most eloquent critical thinking style questions in pathophys and phys. They suck at everything else. Just like on the MCAT they were only good at the physical sciences section (old version)

U world straight up hunts for new guidelines (like giving ****ing hep A vaccine to younger than 41 but immunglobulin older than 41) to write questions. Yeah sometimes you see something interesting like electrical alterans, pulsus paradoxus, all the pressures equalizing in the chambers, etc is tamponade, but even that can be easily remembered and isn't intuitively hard at all to "get." don't get me started on arrhythmias and ACLS. if a the average 260 scorer can explain mechanistically well why CHADSVASC only applies to non valvular afib rather than a fib in general , I will be thoroughly impressed. Of course some can do that type of stuff. But many can't. That to me has consistently shown that deep understanding and rationalization of pathophysiology might help but is certainly not a requisite for scoring high.

@Newyawk you know how to pull my ass into these things lol. I really did enjoy some of our old discussions on the topic.

btw, I personally know two non URM males with low 250s scores and fair amount (not incredible) research that matched into elite tier (like top 5) uro and ENT residencies respectively. n=2 I know. anecdote I know. And a 250 is acheivable by pretty much anyone that meritocratically gets into med school. we can argue all day a 270 requires more "genius." but looking at the match, that is so impractical. the returns seem to be a lot more diminishing than people project on here.

Medicine is quite fair for allopathic MD students who get in meritocratically. they have the tools to succeed barring extremely extenuating personal circumstances and an extreme stubbornness not to conform to proven strategies.

This post resonates with me so much. First, I need to mention that I love medicine and can't imagine doing anything else within reason. That said, I want to say that as I finish M2 (having covered all real systems/topics) I can think of maybe like 10 things that required true understanding and critical thinking to "get" and even then it wasn't really needed to answer any exam questions. I feel safe to say that I pretty much never get a question wrong because I didn't understand something, but almost exclusively because I didn't know some extra 1-line factoid about a topic (which I later look up in Zanki and I just haven't gotten to it). My classmates CONSTANTLY complain about professors "not teaching them and just reading slides" and I just don't get it. What is there to explain? This isn't quantum physics. In fact, if the slides aren't ****, all they should do is literally read the slides.

I honestly think that after a certain level of test taking ability, it is literally a race to see who can memorize the most. Sure one could elucidate some minor nuances based on critical thinking without memorizing these extra facts, but it is far easier and less time consuming to just memorize UFAPS + extras. Step 1 isn't an IQ test to get a 250.
 
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This post resonates with me so much. First, I need to mention that I love medicine and can't imagine doing anything else within reason. That said, I want to say that as I finish M2 (having covered all real systems/topics) I can think of maybe like 10 things that required true understanding and critical thinking to "get" and even then it wasn't really needed to answer any exam questions. I feel safe to say that I pretty much never get a question wrong because I didn't understand something, but almost exclusively because I didn't know some extra 1-line factoid about a topic (which I later look up in Zanki and I just haven't gotten to it). My classmates CONSTANTLY complain about professors "not teaching them and just reading slides" and I just don't get it. What is there to explain? This isn't quantum physics. In fact, if the slides aren't ****, all they should do is literally read the slides.

I honestly think that after a certain level of test taking ability, it is literally a race to see who can memorize the most. Sure one could elucidate some minor nuances based on critical thinking without memorizing these extra facts, but it is far easier and less time consuming to just memorize UFAPS + extras. Step 1 isn't an IQ test to get a 250.
Have you taken step yet? Mind if I ask how you did? Wouldn't you agree that it's pretty complicated information? Do you believe that anyone with no intelligence could be a doctor and do med school?
 
Have you taken step yet? Mind if I ask how you did? Wouldn't you agree that it's pretty complicated information? Do you believe that anyone with no intelligence could be a doctor and do med school?
anyone with average intelligence could go to medical school. That doesnt mean most people in medical school are of average intelligence.
The information isnt complicated, there is just a lot of small facts you have to know.
 
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Have you taken step yet? Mind if I ask how you did? Wouldn't you agree that it's pretty complicated information? Do you believe that anyone with no intelligence could be a doctor and do med school?
Nope, I am a lowly M2, but I don't expect to feel differently after taking step 1. It isn't going to revolutionize an opinion I formed after being exposed to UW, Rx, Kaplan, NBME etc.

This is heading off topic, but for your last question, of course I don't think an idiot could complete medical school or be a competent doctor. Killing step 1 and being a good doctor are not the same thing though, either. They do not require the same demands from an individual, clearly. When people use terms like "understand" or "think critically" they mean different things when talking about clinical vs preclinical environments. Medicine is still an art, but preclinical obviously isn't.
 
Nope, I am a lowly M2, but I don't expect to feel differently after taking step 1. It isn't going to revolutionize an opinion I formed after being exposed to UW, Rx, Kaplan, NBME etc.

This is heading off topic, but for your last question, of course I don't think an idiot could complete medical school or be a competent doctor. Killing step 1 and being a good doctor are not the same thing though, either. They do not require the same demands from an individual, clearly. When people use terms like "understand" or "think critically" they mean different things when talking about clinical vs preclinical environments. Medicine is still an art, but preclinical obviously isn't.
This makes sense. Just out of curiosity, would you consider the MCAT to have a similar issue?
anyone with average intelligence could go to medical school. That doesnt mean most people in medical school are of average intelligence.
The information isnt complicated, there is just a lot of small facts you have to know.
Gotcha. In your eyes, does average intelligence define average work ethic?
 
This makes sense. Just out of curiosity, would you consider the MCAT to have a similar issue?

Gotcha. In your eyes, does average intelligence define average work ethic?
the old old mcat used to have good enough correlations with IQ tests where mensa would grant you membership based on it. I dont think you can quite brute force the mcat like you can STEP 1 considering CARS .

Average intelligence is a measure of intelligence not work ethic. Schools being P/F some one could easily put in 40 hours a week and pass medical school. I know plenty of people who have made it up to the end of m2 that have constantly been cramming for exams three days before the test and passing.
 
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