Hopkins vs U of T?

[Hi There]

I am looking for a bit of help here. I have been accepted to Hopkins, which I really love and have dreamed of going to. While the University of Toronto has not sent out decisions yet, I feel fairly confident about my chances. U of Toronto is my first choice in Canada.

I was very very impressed by Hopkins, but because of the much higher costs, I want to make sure I am fully informed. Due to the heavy financial investment, I am particularly interested in how attending Hopkins over U of T will give me benefits in competitive residency placements/a future medical career, both in Canada and the U.S. I know that the University of Toronto is an excellent medical school that is very well respected both in Canada and internationally, but I have the impression that Hopkins is on a level of its own.

Any advice from people familiar with either/both schools would be greatly appreciated!

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[moo]

I am looking for a bit of help here. I have been accepted to Hopkins, which I really love and have dreamed of going to. While the University of Toronto has not sent out decisions yet, I feel fairly confident about my chances. U of Toronto is my first choice in Canada.

I was very very impressed by Hopkins, but because of the much higher costs, I want to make sure I am fully informed. Due to the heavy financial investment, I am particularly interested in how attending Hopkins over U of T will give me benefits in competitive residency placements/a future medical career, both in Canada and the U.S. I know that the University of Toronto is an excellent medical school that is very well respected both in Canada and internationally, but I have the impression that Hopkins is on a level of its own.

While I have heard much praise for Hopkins, I have also heard that at such a large institution it may be more difficult to obtain good letters of recommendation from program directors, much needed when applying for residency. Some have also remarked that it is easier to be admitted to an American medical school than to a Canadian one (perhaps true based on the law of averages but surely not so in the case of Hopkins?). Any thoughts on this?

Any advice from people familiar with either/both schools would be greatly appreciated!

I knew someone from undergrad who was accepted to Hopkins, Harvard, UT and UBC. She chose Hopkins. To her and me, it's a no-brainer. Yes, UT is well-respected and you can't go wrong with it, but the chance to study at Hopkins with some of the brightest minds is unparalleled. And whether it's easier to be admitted to a US school or not varies greatly from institution to institution. Yes, it's easier to get into the lower tier schools like Finch, NYMC, Temple, etc. but to get into the top notch schools like Hopkins and Harvard is a different story. I know people who had multiple interviews/acceptances in Canada who weren't even interviewed at any of the top 20 schools in the US.

It also of course depends on what you want to do in the future. If you want to practice in academia, then Hopkins by far will be better. If you want to do FP or primary care then UT would probably be better (financially).

Bottom line is you can't go wrong with either school. But if I were you, I'd pick Hopkins.

 

[Hi There]

Thank you for the advice. It's very hard to find information comparing Canadian and American medical schools (the only source I could find was the now-extinct Gourman report). I plan to enter one of the surgical specialties, particularly neurosurgery. Of course, I am fully aware that my goal may change during my time in medical school, but this is what I am aiming for. Hence my interest in how going to Hopkins will give me an advantage over going to U of T when it comes to placement in a competitive residency.

Thank you very much for your help. If you have any more information, especially about applying for residencies as a Hopkins med student, I would greatly appreciate it.

 

[russellb]

What you have to ask yourself is where you want to be in 5 years, 10 years, and 20 years. If you want a top notch US residency and a shot at top US practices down the road, Hopkins will give you an advantage. However, there are U of T students who manage to get good US residencies, but they're not likely to be as highly regarded as Hopkins grads.

About 12 years ago, I was faced with choosing between Penn and Dalhousie med schools. I grew up in Montreal, but did my B.A. at Penn and I really wanted to stay there (a lousy interview at McGill eliminated that med school from consideration ). Penn is obviously far more prestigious than Dal. However, I was uncomfortable with the debt load that I was going to have to take at Penn, so I chose Dal. I didn't apply to residency in the US, and did my residency at U. of Ottawa. Guess where I ended up for my fellowship----if you guessed Hopkins, you're correct. As such, I was actually able to compete for good academic and private practice positions in the US (chose Toronto for family reasons and a competitive job offer), but I would likely have had even more US offers had I attended Penn med.

In any event, answer for yourself the questions about where you want to be in the future, and your decision will be easier.

 

[hermanodequeso]

hi there,

i don't know too much about u. of toronto, but i went to med school at hopkins and loved it. baltimore takes some getting used to, but i wouldn't trade the experience for anything. you're right to try to stay open-minded about your potential career paths. however, if you are really serious about neurosurgery, then i would recommend that you head straight to hopkins. that department is nothing short of amazing and is one of the most highly sought after residency slots in the field. the chair and faculty are fantastic and treat the medical students and residents with respect. teaching is top-notch and they let you do a ton in the OR. every year, there are several students who are turned on to neurosurg because that department/rotation is so sweet. last year, all three spots went to hopkins med students, so they clearly like to keep their own and the neurosurg students consistently match well. the department is very well connected and supportive. it's in their best interest to make sure all of their students match. even in years with 10 or so neurosurg students (rare), they all seem to match. honestly, if neurosurg is your bag, hopkins NUS will definately help seal the deal, just so long as you work hard and are pleasant to be around.

for people interested in family practice, hopkins is a terrible place. you will not be supported and with receive lots of pressure to change to internal medicine instead. also, the dermatology department is notorious for not supporting med students through the match process. most other departments are very supportive in difficult matches.....neurosurg, ENT, urology, radiation oncology, radiology.

it's a tough choice, but i agree with the above poster about really sitting down to think about what you'd like to do and where you'd like to be.

best of luck.

 

[Hi There]

Thank you for all the useful information. Herman, do you know anything about applying to other specialties from Hopkins? I've also considered opthalmology, and would be interested in how much support the department at Hopkins gives. Also, it seems to me that faculty at Hopkins are very accessible to the med students. One thing I have heard, however, is that at such a big name institution it may be harder to find program directors to write strong letters of recommendation for you. Is this heresay?

 

[eddieberetta]

Both are excellent medical schools. Toronto is basically regarded as Canada's largest and top medical school (I am biased of course, but it is consistently rated tops in magazine surveys and in terms of funding is much larger than any of the other centers). Toronto has an international reputation obviously for the discovery of insulin, the CF gene, advances in cardiac surgery, the Hospital for Sick Children, etc. However, Hopkins obviously has even greater name recognition (even accounting for the US-bias on this forum).

I would like to correct an error posted above regarding the match. Canadian MD students can enter the first match of either or both of the Can and US match (as can Americans). You will have ample opportunity to match to competitive specialties from either school. Toronto grads who have entered the US match have consistently matched to top tier US residencies, and of course to the top Canadian programs, even in very competitive fields.

In regards to NSx, Toronto has the largest (and one of the oldest) NSx programs in North America, and a renowned pediatric NSX division at the Hospital for Sick Children (ask your attendings).

Toronto is also not an ideal choice for PCP oriented types because you are innundated with (sub-sub-sub) specialists and it hard to find role models.

Having said all this, I would reiterate that JHU is a fantastic medical school and an excellent choice. Good luck deciding.

 

[hermanodequeso]

hi there,

sorry to have taken a while in getting back to you....trauma surgery is whupping my hide. anyhow, in general i would say that the program directors at hopkins are quite accessible. Ophthalmology is a little touch and go, depending on how much the director of the med student rotation (required) likes you. However, there are many other mentors within the department who are excellent. Dr. Neil Miller is hands-down one of the smartest people with whom I've ever worked. Plus, Wilmer Eye is pretty well connected and the ophtho students also tend to match very well.

Really, the only departments that aren't that supportive are derm and plastics.

I'm sure your choice is difficult, but it really sounds like you're in a win-win situation.

best of luck.

 

[Retinamark]

Agree about Wilmer Ophthal - It consistently ranks No 1 in the Ophthal rankings. Agree too about Niel Miller - one of the smartest guys in Neuro-Ophthal in the world. His presentations at conferences are outstanding! If you were interested in Neuro-Ophthalmology, his would have to be the best fellowship in the world.

 

[Loula]

If you have money, Go to Hopkins!!!

 

[Retinamark]

If you have money, Go to Hopkins!!!

How much does it cost to go to Hopkins?

 

[Loula]

don't know but think of the exchange rate, whether or not you're considered international in either, and do the math.
Think also of future work, doctors make much more money in the states, and there is a statistic that more than 50% of M.D.s in Canada move to the states.

 

[Souvik_Sen]

HOPKINZZZ????? BROTHA U ARE MADE FOR LIFE!!!