Forget how much to retire, WHERE to retire

[caligas]

we’re all anesthesiologists here, we’re gonna have 5, 10, 15+ million

So my question is WHERE to retire.

My wife wants hot weather and some charm and/or walkability.

I want a very large airport within a couple hours and the ability to play golf without fighting crowds or doing a massive membership wait list (rules out Scottsdale and Orlando).

Drivable to some sort of ski resort would be a big bonus.

I’m wondering about Palm Springs, although you would definitely have to get out during the summer and not sure about tax implications of living in California as a retiree

Also maybe Tampa/Sarasota. Obviously no snow skiing there.

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[dchz]

Uptown Dallas.

Walkable, warm.

DAL 5-10 mins away.

DFW 20 mins away.

Tons of municipal golf courses around.

 

[Dr. Rude]

I have seen a few docs retire to the dream location. Within a few years several relocated to where their kids/grandkids dropped anchor. Also know of a few others that would relocate to where their kids were, but the kids could not commit to staying put.

 

[coffeebythelake]

What tax implications to live in a no state tax place like Washington state while spending half the year in a LCOL country like Vietnam?

 

[deleted1189238]

I’d live in Vietnam. It’s amazing. Clean and cheap. Friendly to English speakers.

Not sure what it means to live in a no tax state.

 

[wysdoc]

I’d live in Vietnam. It’s amazing. Clean and cheap. Friendly to English speakers.

Not sure what it means to live in a no tax state.

You pay federal income tax but there is no state income tax.
Most states without state income tax will have a sales tax instead, or higher property taxes.

 

[aneftp]

Florida used to be cheaper. It’s not. I was gonna to suggest Orlando or parts of Arizona but just noticed you said no Orlando or Scottsdale lol.

West side of Florida is too “quiet” once you get south past the Tampa/clearwater area.

I don’t like Miami (to live) at all.

Maybe Ponte Vedra (30 min south of Jacksonville) good golfing. It’s not cheap there anymore either. Has tpc golf course and other surround golf courses around there and its accessible to the beach nearby.

All the New Yorkers have driven up housing prices there as well

 

[luckybuck]

Why wait to retire to your dream location? Move there now

 

[triggermaster]

I have seen a few docs retire to the dream location. Within a few years several relocated to where their kids/grandkids dropped anchor. Also know of a few others that would relocate to where their kids were, but the kids could not commit to staying put.

Seeing grandkids a lot, if you have them, is supposedly very good for you and probably good for them. Everyone’s situation is different, but it’s something to consider for a lot of us.

 

[GravelRider]

It wouldn’t make sense financially, but NYC would be a good place to retire. Nearly infinite walkability, which benefits as you age 65 and older. A lot of daily walking is associated with longevity. There are plenty of clubs, classes, and other activities to keep your mind engaged. Obviously one of the busiest airport systems in the world gives you plenty of options for travel and for people to travel to you. Cost consideration inherently limits the size of the place you live, so less to maintain as you age. Northeastern and North Atlantic weather is reasonably mild with 4 distinct seasons without the intolerable heat of Southern summers (keeps you inside and inactive). Obviously costs like taxes and housing make NYC pretty unattractive for retirement.

 

[caligas]

Florida used to be cheaper. It’s not. I was gonna to suggest Orlando or parts of Arizona but just noticed you said no Orlando or Scottsdale lol.

West side of Florida is too “quiet” once you get south past the Tampa/clearwater area.

I don’t like Miami (to live) at all.

Maybe Ponte Vedra (30 min south of Jacksonville) good golfing. It’s not cheap there anymore either. Has tpc golf course and other surround golf courses around there and its accessible to the beach nearby.

All the New Yorkers have driven up housing prices there as well

Yeah, Orlando could probably work with public golf. Scottsdale is $300/round for average courses during the on season and private courses are pretty inaccessible. Just a massive supply/demand imbalance for golf Oct-April

 

[Hoya11]

It wouldn’t make sense financially, but NYC would be a good place to retire. Nearly infinite walkability, which benefits as you age 65 and older. A lot of daily walking is associated with longevity. There are plenty of clubs, classes, and other activities to keep your mind engaged. Obviously one of the busiest airport systems in the world gives you plenty of options for travel and for people to travel to you. Cost consideration inherently limits the size of the place you live, so less to maintain as you age. Northeastern and North Atlantic weather is reasonably mild with 4 distinct seasons without the intolerable heat of Southern summers (keeps you inside and inactive). Obviously costs like taxes and housing make NYC pretty unattractive for retirement.

i like dc for similar reasons

always stuff to do, walkable, warm, airport close by, cheap property taxes

 

[Splenda88]

Somewhere in Spain or Kuala Lumpur.

 

[DaisyBuchanan]

Santa Barbara. That's where I'll be heading in retirement

 

[aneftp]

I live in a retirement area. I ain’t moving anywhere.
Championship golf, fast clay courts plus hard courts near by. Just got another new golf cart to drive around.

 

[pgg]

The best answer is to move to your retirement dream location right now, and work there. Odds are there's a hospital nearby.

Life is short, why wait?

The only reason I can think of is if you want to spend a few years grinding away and making >90% MGMA to get ahead on savings, before moving to your dream location. See for example @sevoflurane.

We moved to our retirement destination as soon as I left the Navy and finally got to choose where we live. I've still got some years of full time work ahead of me.

 

[LivetoTell]

What about Mill Valley, California? I heard it’s 15 minutes to San Francisco, but has a quaint small town vibe, with restaurants,etc. Good weather, nature with lots of walking/hiking trails. Negative would be HCOL.

 

[amyl]

Probably stuck in dallas w dchz… husbands kids here so even when he retires… I like dallas now… I hope it doesn’t get any more popular than it is

 

[aneftp]

Probably stuck in dallas w dchz… husbands kids here so even when he retires… I like dallas now… I hope it doesn’t get any more popular than it is

Dallas is crazy. Business booming there. My bff is there. Anesthesia market for 1099 does suck there though.

 

[IIMC]

Reno, NV. Beautiful golf courses, a very short drive to Tahoe (both winter/summer fun), no state income tax, low property tax, very easy airport (less than 60 min flight to SFO), moderate politics, sunny over 300 days/year. No place is perfect but this checks a lot of boxes.

 

[okayplayer]

Reno, NV. Beautiful golf courses, a very short drive to Tahoe (both winter/summer fun), no state income tax, low property tax, very easy airport (less than 60 min flight to SFO), moderate politics, sunny over 300 days/year. No place is perfect but this checks a lot of boxes.

Yes! @sevoflurane

 

[GassYous]

Reno, NV. Beautiful golf courses, a very short drive to Tahoe (both winter/summer fun), no state income tax, low property tax, very easy airport (less than 60 min flight to SFO), moderate politics, sunny over 300 days/year. No place is perfect but this checks a lot of boxes.

Yes I have some family that live out in sparks and they love it. Walking distance to a golf course, great views from a hill overlooking the valley, easy access to great hiking and skiing/snowboarding. I don't think I could live there personally but it seems like a desirable place to me.

 

[cchoukal]

What about Mill Valley, California? I heard it’s 15 minutes to San Francisco, but has a quaint small town vibe, with restaurants,etc. Good weather, nature with lots of walking/hiking trails. Negative would be HCOL.

I would call it VHCOL; think +/- $1000/sqft for housing. I live north of there in a neighboring suburb, however, and I agree that if you can afford it, the area is wonderful. For retirees, there are a lot of cultural activities (The Whistle-stop center has lots of classes and things. There's a theater company, endless outdoor activities, man areas walkable, great transit (for a suburb) including an hourly shuttle to SFO that is subsidized by the county. 2+ hrs from Tahoe. For Caligas, what about Sacramento? Warm, golf, drive to skiing?

 

[GassYous]

I would call it VHCOL; think +/- $1000/sqft for housing. I live north of there in a neighboring suburb, however, and I agree that if you can afford it, the area is wonderful. For retirees, there are a lot of cultural activities (The Whistle-stop center has lots of classes and things. There's a theater company, endless outdoor activities, man areas walkable, great transit (for a suburb) including an hourly shuttle to SFO that is subsidized by the county. 2+ hrs from Tahoe. For Caligas, what about Sacramento? Warm, golf, drive to skiing?

If I'm living in california and I have money, I'm living in socal, not sacramento

 

[dchz]

The best answer is to move to your retirement dream location right now, and work there. Odds are there's a hospital nearby.

Life is short, why wait?

The only reason I can think of is if you want to spend a few years grinding away and making >90% MGMA to get ahead on savings, before moving to your dream location. See for example @sevoflurane.

We moved to our retirement destination as soon as I left the Navy and finally got to choose where we live. I've still got some years of full time work ahead of me.

I did it right out of fellowship.

Probably stuck in dallas w dchz… husbands kids here so even when he retires… I like dallas now… I hope it doesn’t get any more popular than it is

I don't really like the uptown crowd. I'm in the burbs. The other choice was San Diego. I may never know what might have been, but felt like the right choice for me.b

 

[GassYous]

I did it right out of fellowship.



I don't really like the uptown crowd. I'm in the burbs. The other choice was San Diego. I may never know what might have been, but felt like the right choice for me.b

Yeah uptown is not highland park enough for me

 

[wysdoc]

Nashville's a pretty lively city, adjacent suburbs have lots of golf and walking/running/bike trails, live music

If you want charming, NCarolina or SCarolina?

 

[mdo1738]

Nashville's a pretty lively city, adjacent suburbs have lots of golf and walking/running/bike trails, live music

If you want charming, NCarolina or SCarolina?

N Carolina is not charming. Easily the worst place I’ve lived.

 

[Splenda88]

N Carolina is not charming. Easily the worst place I’ve lived.

I think you are confusing N Carolina with Kansas.

 

[amyl]

Yeah uptown is not highland park enough for me

Are you in dallas too? I live in midway hollow… it’s pretty convenient

 

[aneftp]

Why would anyone “retire” in California if their 401k pretax accounts subject to 9.25-11% state income taxes?

Many super rich California based people have primary homes in Nevada Texas Washington state Florida etc.

 

[neutro]

I don't think I will ever retire...its not in my nature to sit idle. I haven't taken a full week of vacation since March of last year for instance. I like what I do and keep busy. Ive had those 10-12 week off jobs and I don't know if those are for me. I prefer quality time off when i need vs random weeks off. To me, that causes less burnout.

Dallas suburbs are just fine raising a family.
My kids love their school and wife is very happy. Life is stable. Great place to start a business and real estate investing. I wish I had moved here after fellowship but its not too late. I wish I had bought more real estate but its never too late for that. Market appreciation is amazing here but good deals are hard to come by.

When feasible, I'll probably end up going to 1/2 and 1/2 schedule - 26 weeks on and off...or some combo when kids leave for college. I don't think I will ever fully "retire". So I do not take these retirement numbers seriously. I will always have an income even if my net worth is zero for instance. ill work unless i'm no longer mentally sharp or physically able.

Plan is to move to Manhattan eventually - Upper East Side. Walk everywhere. Amazing culture, food, arts, diversity. Top notch hospitals for healthcare and if needed, take academic position.
Take a taxi plus train to JFK - fly out. Don't need to have a car...the other half travel, or spend time in motherland with my childhood friends that I still keep in touch with.

13 more years...52 sounds good for retirement and cutting back.

 

[BLADEMDA]

Retire in a no tax state and there are quite a few to choose from. That’s the best way to keep more of your 10+ million portfolio.

 

[mdo1738]

I think you are confusing N Carolina with Kansas.

Definitely North Carolina, where the people aren’t friendly and they try to pass vinegar water off as barbecue sauce.

 

[GassYous]

Are you in dallas too? I live in midway hollow… it’s pretty convenient

Dallas adjacent

 

[caligas]

Why would anyone “retire” in California if their 401k pretax accounts subject to 9.25-11% state income taxes?

Many super rich California based people have primary homes in Nevada Texas Washington state Florida etc.

Not arguing the benefits of no state income taxes!

but keep in mind 9-11 is a marginal rate. If you have 10M and half is in pre tax account and you pull a 3% SWR you will pay Cali (very roughly) ~ $10K per year. This may be an acceptable premium to some for the positives offered by some California locations.

Might be more when you hit RMD age and SS but SS should cover that tax expense.

 

[cchoukal]

Not arguing the benefits of no state income taxes!

but keep in mind 9-11 is a marginal rate. If you have 10M and half is in pre tax account and you pull a 3% SWR you will pay Cali (very roughly) ~ $10K per year. This may be an acceptable premium to some for the positives offered by some California locations.

Agreed. Even in our highest earning years, AMT and all, our EFFECTIVE tax rate was never more than 30%, combined state and federal.

 

[repititionition]

I’d live in Vietnam. It’s amazing. Clean and cheap. Friendly to English speakers.

Not sure what it means to live in a no tax state.

What these expatriate dreams always neglect to consider is need for healthcare, but it’s a near-guarantee in retirement.

The only place you’re going to reliably get competent care in that region is in Thailand.

 

[GassYous]

What these expatriate dreams always neglect to consider is need for healthcare, but it’s a near-guarantee in retirement.

The only place you’re going to reliably get competent care in that region is in Thailand.

Just give me a pound of penicillin and I'm good

 

[Status Sciaticus]

Uptown Dallas.

Walkable, warm.

DAL 5-10 mins away.

DFW 20 mins away.

Tons of municipal golf courses around.

I thought about uptown, but it looked deserted when I was there during the eclipse weekend.
Debating between Dallas and San Antonio at the moment.

 

[sevoflurane]

Reno, NV. Beautiful golf courses, a very short drive to Tahoe (both winter/summer fun), no state income tax, low property tax, very easy airport (less than 60 min flight to SFO), moderate politics, sunny over 300 days/year. No place is perfect but this checks a lot of boxes.

And this is just scrapping the surface. This past weekend we were poolside all day Saturday and Sunday... and yesterday after work. It was 84 at my house on Saturday, but all the mountains are still snow capped- bluebird weekend. Can literally ski, mountain bike, moto, kite surf, and boat all on the same day. Heading out first thing tomorrow post 3rd call to fly into San Jose. 45 minute flight to SJ then hitting up Santa Cruz for the day. Dinner back in the bay area with my elderly folks. Direct flights to Vegas (caught U2 at the sphere a few months ago then TOOL a few weeks later), SF, Phoenix, San Diego, Dallas, LA, Seattle, Portland... just to name a few. We don't have the foodie scene like LA, SF, or Vegas, but we have enough of it (indian, thai, greek, expensive steak houses, more sushi restaurants than you could ever want, etc). Summers here are so good. There is some sort of festival going on just about every weekend. Summers start early and end late. Something to do every season.
One thing we have in oversupply is the beauty of the eastern Sierras (bonus- we are a dry climate so NO BUGS).

Live where others vacation... it's been said on this forum ever since I joined here 20 years ago.

 

[sevoflurane]

 

[sevoflurane]

Zero chance I move again. Perfect for retirement.

 

[GassYous]

And this is just scrapping the surface. This past weekend we were poolside all day Saturday and Sunday... and yesterday after work. It was 84 at my house on Saturday, but all the mountains are still snow capped- bluebird weekend. Can literally ski, mountain bike, moto, kite surf, and boat all on the same day. Heading out first thing tomorrow post 3rd call to fly into San Jose. 45 minute flight to SJ then hitting up Santa Cruz for the day. Dinner back in the bay area with my elderly folks. Direct flights to Vegas (caught U2 at the sphere a few months ago then TOOL a few weeks later), SF, Phoenix, San Diego, Dallas, LA, Seattle, Portland... just to name a few. We don't have the foodie scene like LA, SF, or Vegas, but we have enough of it (indian, thai, greek, expensive steak houses, more sushi restaurants than you could ever want, etc). Summers here are so good. There is some sort of festival going on just about every weekend. Summers start early and end late. Something to do every season.
One thing we have in oversupply is the beauty of the eastern Sierras (bonus- we are a dry climate so NO BUGS).

Live where others vacation... it's been said on this forum ever since I joined here 20 years ago.

I wish I was you
but reno ain't working for my wife so

 

[circleK]

Will retire in whatever city the cutest grandkids end up living. Here’s hoping it’s not rural

 

[pgg]

Just give me a pound of penicillin and I'm good

It actually wouldn't be.

I worked at a hospital in Hanoi for a few months. Their antibiogram was one of the scariest things I've ever seen in my life. Everything was resistant to multiple drugs. Everything. The overuse and misuse of antibiotics there is something to behold.

You might as well treat an infection with harsh language as penicillin there, for all the good it'll do you.

 

[sevoflurane]

I wish I was you
but reno ain't working for my wife so

A lot of people don’t understand Reno and it’s lay out. Most think of the downtown area. It’s nice from the Helipad, but there are so many other options in the surrounding area.

Montreoux (was part of the pga tour if you like to golf ), Ranchera, St. James Village are great in town options. If you want to live in the Mountains right next to lakes there is always Verdi,Truckee, Tahoe City, Incline village and a host of towns around Tahoe. The city is bigger than most think. Over 1/2 a million with a catchment area of about a million… but still drives like a small city (little traffic). Progressive city with an outdoor minded population.

 

[sevoflurane]

You can live 15 minutes from Mount Rose, which in my opinion is the best kept ski resort of all 15 ski resort options. First chair, tear up some steep and deep powder. Home by 11am and at work by 3pm on first call.
You just can’t beat that life hack efficiency.

 

[finalpsychyear]

Will live near family and friends as a baseline so midwest area but it really doesn't snow here anymore.

Plan to take 2-4 wks air bnb every other month and experience different cities not just in the US but worldwide.
Maybe rent a place if someplace really strikes my fancy for several months then move on. More travel in good market return years and a bit less in lower ones.

 

[amyl]

You can live 15 minutes from Mount Rose, which in my opinion is the best kept ski resort of all 15 ski resort options. First chair, tear up some steep and deep powder. Home by 11am and at work by 3pm on first call.
You just can’t beat that life hack efficiency.

Don’t doubt it sevo…. Your practice is one I think we all genuinely admire… Reno seems great too… I’d be calling you in a heartbeat if the hubby could find a job up there