DO's in Rheumatology

[gatewasani]

Hi, I'm a 2nd year IM resident at a Community program in the Northeast.

Taking a look at the top Rheumatology programs fellowship rosters, I see very few DO's. I have seen a number of Caribbean grads and FMGs but very few DOs. Anyone know why that is. Is Rheum not a DO friendly fellowship?

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[drfunktacular]

I think it's difficult to predict right now. Once upon a time rheumatology was not competitive at all, now recently it is (at least somewhat). So it's hard to predict admissions decisions

 

[Raryn]

Last year (table 2), 29 DOs matched in Rheum, compared to 118 US grads and 40 IMGs. That is, 13.3% of the total matched applicants were DOs.

If we go back to the 2015 main residency match data given it's the same cohort, 511 DOs matched IM out of 6770 people total, meaning DOs were only 7.5% of that group. Now, that match does not include any osteopathic IM programs so it is likely to be an under-estimate, but even still, it looks like DOs are actually proportionally over-represented among those IM residents who move on to Rheumatology.

 

[gatewasani]

given it's the same cohort, 511 DOs matched IM out of 6770 people total, meaning DOs were only 7.5% of that group. Now, that match does not include any osteopathic IM programs so it is likely to be an under-estimate, but even still, it looks like DOs are actually proportionally over-represented among those IM residents who move on to Rheumatology.

Yes, I saw those numbers, I guess my question was why aren't they matching at top university programs. And, I think the answer is that a DO degree is still something to overcome as rheumatology is a bit more competitive then I once imagined it to be. That, or the fellowship rosters aren't updated, who knows? Would be interested in hearing from DO's who recently went through the match process and their experience

 

[Raryn]

Yes, I saw those numbers, I guess my question was why aren't they matching at top university programs. And, I think the answer is that a DO degree is still something to overcome as rheumatology is a bit more competitive then I once imagined it to be. That, or the fellowship rosters aren't updated, who knows? Would be interested in hearing from DO's who recently went through the match process and their experience

Two things: If DOs are only 13% of people and the average program has 2 spots, even with a totally random distribution, you'd expect 3/4 of programs to not have a DO in any given year. Half wouldn't have DOs in the program at all.

The other thing is that the true "top" programs primarily care about research pedigree. They're the ones that require a third year of fellowship, etc. Many IMGs have an extensive research pedigree. Most DOs don't (some do, but it's just not a focus at DO schools and DO programs in general). Even a little bit of bias there probably explains what you're seeing.

I don't know about rheum personally, but my bet is any accreditdd program in the country will get you appropriate clinical training. The top ones just will get you research experience too.

 

[doctorbeastmode]

Strong second to the research side of it. The top rheum programs are very research focused and tend to pull applicants from research heavy IM programs. You’ll have a good chance of matching to a top rheum program as a DO if you have comparable research experience and are coming from a strong IM program. If you’re coming from a middling IM program and have no research, you shouldn’t expect to be competitive at top research places.

There are plenty of good places to get clinical training in rheum that aren’t research heavy, so don’t stress if you’re in that boat.

 

[skichick12]

I'm a DO that graduated from a community program and matched at an academic ACGME rheum fellowship. I also only took the COMLEX. I had some case reports and 1 research presentation. No publications. I just applied all over and ended up getting a fair number of interviews. During the interviews, I did get asked about being a DO or about the COMLEX a few times but obviously it all worked out because I matched.

 

[drfunktacular]

To slightly restate what others have said above: matching into *a program* vs a specific program may be two different things.

Will you match at NYU or Hopkins as a DO from a community program? Odds are against you. But that's not necessarily a bad thing if it isn't your goal in life to become an NIH-funded researcher (and since you're at an osteopathic community IM residency, I would guess that isn't your priority). Among other things, many of those programs are going to extract an extra year of your life from you to staff their research program--potentially a $150-200k opportunity cost vs entering practice a year earlier.

If you just want to be a good rheumatologist in community practice, any program with a busy clinical service will train you appropriately if you put in the time reading. So when you're applying, make realistic decisions about where to send your applications. I don't think applying to the top 10/20 academic programs would be worth your time or money to be honest, but those programs might not be best suited for your career goals anyway.

 

[FohBay]

I'm a DO that graduated from a community program and matched at an academic ACGME rheum fellowship. I also only took the COMLEX. I had some case reports and 1 research presentation. No publications. I just applied all over and ended up getting a fair number of interviews. During the interviews, I did get asked about being a DO or about the COMLEX a few times but obviously it all worked out because I matched.

Skichick12, my application is very similar to yours and I was wondering if you are willing to share how many interviews you have received? I applied very broadly as well and I am hoping to get more interviews this week. Also, what specific questions did they ask you about being a DO and the COMLEX? Thank you in advance!

 

[skichick12]

Skichick12, my application is very similar to yours and I was wondering if you are willing to share how many interviews you have received? I applied very broadly as well and I am hoping to get more interviews this week. Also, what specific questions did they ask you about being a DO and the COMLEX? Thank you in advance!

I sent you a private message.