Considering Medical School

[DrPepperr]

Hello,

I am currently considering medical school. I graduated from a university in the US in 2019 with a Bachelors of Science degree in Biology. I then completed a Masters of Arts in Teaching degree in 2020 and have been teaching high school science (Biology, Environmental science, Integrated science) for the past 4 years.

I am looking for advice on what steps I would need to take in order to get into med school and how long it would take me to get there. Since I have only begun researching the topic of med school, the only relevant information about myself is listed below:

Undergrad
- 2019: B.S. in Biology - Overall GPA - 2.59
- President of Lacrosse team
Graduate
- 2020: M.A. in teaching - Overall GPA - 3.87
- Teacher residency program
Professional
- 2020 - present: High school science teacher (Biology, Environmental Science, Integrated Science)
- Boys lacrosse head coach

Again, looking to get some advice on what steps I would need to take in order to get into med school and how long it would take me to get there. If I should repost this into another section of this forum let me know!

Thanks!
-DrPepperr

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[AJS59]

Let's look at this step by step:

-Classes: How many pre-reqs have you completed, and how did you perform in those? You have a major in biology so I think you've at least satisfied the introductory biology classes, and there's probably a decent chance you completed Gen Chem. So that'd only leave Orgo, Biochem, Psych/Sociology (not strictly necessary, but recommended for the MCAT), Physics, and any additional upper level science classes you'd want to add on. Given your uGPA is low and your masters degree is an MA in teaching, I am thinking you may be best served by either a formal post-bacc or SMP, most of which take 1-2 years. You MUST do well in either program in order to boost your odds of medical school
-MCAT: Best left for last, both so that 1. You have mastered the material and 2. MCAT scores do expire after 3 years for most schools. I wouldn't even start studying for it until after you have finished Biochem.
-Clinical experience/shadowing: You will need at least 50 hours of shadowing (ideally some with a PCP) and at least 150, ideally 250+, hours of clinical experience. This can take many forms: Volunteering, standard employment, getting an EMT license, etc. Since you are a teacher and I assume working full time from August/September-May/June, I think an EMT license may be best, as it would offer you the ability to work shifts in evenings and on weekends, but again, leave it up to you.
-Non-clinical service work: In addition, I'd try to carve out some time when you can to do service work for underprivileged communities. The best recommendation is something in the form of food distribution, shelter work, job/tax preparation, transport services, or housing rehab. You'll need at least 150 hours in this realm.

As for a timeline: The first thing I would do before even jumping at the academics is shadowing to see if this is something you really really want. The life of a physician isn't always the fun stuff all the time. Once you have a firm commitment towards wanting to do medicine, then I would start to investigate your options w/ regards to an SMP or Post-Bacc and begin to accumulate hours in the other categories.

Realistically speaking, I'd say you're probably a good 2-3 cycles away from being ready to apply especially if you're going to continue working as a teacher full-time. Take your time and don't rush the process!

 

[DrPepperr]

Let's look at this step by step:

-Classes: How many pre-reqs have you completed, and how did you perform in those? You have a major in biology so I think you've at least satisfied the introductory biology classes, and there's probably a decent chance you completed Gen Chem. So that'd only leave Orgo, Biochem, Psych/Sociology (not strictly necessary, but recommended for the MCAT), Physics, and any additional upper level science classes you'd want to add on. Given your uGPA is low and your masters degree is an MA in teaching, I am thinking you may be best served by either a formal post-bacc or SMP, most of which take 1-2 years. You MUST do well in either program in order to boost your odds of medical school
-MCAT: Best left for last, both so that 1. You have mastered the material and 2. MCAT scores do expire after 3 years for most schools. I wouldn't even start studying for it until after you have finished Biochem.
-Clinical experience/shadowing: You will need at least 50 hours of shadowing (ideally some with a PCP) and at least 150, ideally 250+, hours of clinical experience. This can take many forms: Volunteering, standard employment, getting an EMT license, etc. Since you are a teacher and I assume working full time from August/September-May/June, I think an EMT license may be best, as it would offer you the ability to work shifts in evenings and on weekends, but again, leave it up to you.
-Non-clinical service work: In addition, I'd try to carve out some time when you can to do service work for underprivileged communities. The best recommendation is something in the form of food distribution, shelter work, job/tax preparation, transport services, or housing rehab. You'll need at least 150 hours in this realm.

As for a timeline: The first thing I would do before even jumping at the academics is shadowing to see if this is something you really really want. The life of a physician isn't always the fun stuff all the time. Once you have a firm commitment towards wanting to do medicine, then I would start to investigate your options w/ regards to an SMP or Post-Bacc and begin to accumulate hours in the other categories.

Realistically speaking, I'd say you're probably a good 2-3 cycles away from being ready to apply especially if you're going to continue working as a teacher full-time. Take your time and don't rush the process!

Thank you so much for this information. Could not have asked for a better reply to get me on my first steps.

 

[DrPepperr]

Let's look at this step by step:

-Classes: How many pre-reqs have you completed, and how did you perform in those? You have a major in biology so I think you've at least satisfied the introductory biology classes, and there's probably a decent chance you completed Gen Chem. So that'd only leave Orgo, Biochem, Psych/Sociology (not strictly necessary, but recommended for the MCAT), Physics, and any additional upper level science classes you'd want to add on. Given your uGPA is low and your masters degree is an MA in teaching, I am thinking you may be best served by either a formal post-bacc or SMP, most of which take 1-2 years. You MUST do well in either program in order to boost your odds of medical school
-MCAT: Best left for last, both so that 1. You have mastered the material and 2. MCAT scores do expire after 3 years for most schools. I wouldn't even start studying for it until after you have finished Biochem.
-Clinical experience/shadowing: You will need at least 50 hours of shadowing (ideally some with a PCP) and at least 150, ideally 250+, hours of clinical experience. This can take many forms: Volunteering, standard employment, getting an EMT license, etc. Since you are a teacher and I assume working full time from August/September-May/June, I think an EMT license may be best, as it would offer you the ability to work shifts in evenings and on weekends, but again, leave it up to you.
-Non-clinical service work: In addition, I'd try to carve out some time when you can to do service work for underprivileged communities. The best recommendation is something in the form of food distribution, shelter work, job/tax preparation, transport services, or housing rehab. You'll need at least 150 hours in this realm.

As for a timeline: The first thing I would do before even jumping at the academics is shadowing to see if this is something you really really want. The life of a physician isn't always the fun stuff all the time. Once you have a firm commitment towards wanting to do medicine, then I would start to investigate your options w/ regards to an SMP or Post-Bacc and begin to accumulate hours in the other categories.

Realistically speaking, I'd say you're probably a good 2-3 cycles away from being ready to apply especially if you're going to continue working as a teacher full-time. Take your time and don't rush the process!

One thing that came to mind... Do you think since my 4 year teaching career has been at a title 1 school it would satisfy the "Non-clinical service work" portion?

 

[Goro]

Hello,

I am currently considering medical school. I graduated from a university in the US in 2019 with a Bachelors of Science degree in Biology. I then completed a Masters of Arts in Teaching degree in 2020 and have been teaching high school science (Biology, Environmental science, Integrated science) for the past 4 years.

I am looking for advice on what steps I would need to take in order to get into med school and how long it would take me to get there. Since I have only begun researching the topic of med school, the only relevant information about myself is listed below:

Undergrad
- 2019: B.S. in Biology - Overall GPA - 2.59
- President of Lacrosse team
Graduate
- 2020: M.A. in teaching - Overall GPA - 3.87
- Teacher residency program
Professional
- 2020 - present: High school science teacher (Biology, Environmental Science, Integrated Science)
- Boys lacrosse head coach

Again, looking to get some advice on what steps I would need to take in order to get into med school and how long it would take me to get there. If I should repost this into another section of this forum let me know!

Thanks!
-DrPepperr

1 start volunteering with patients
2 shadow doctors to the tune of 50 hrs total

Read my post on reinvention for premeds.

 

[Goro]

One thing that came to mind... Do you think since my 4 year teaching career has been at a title 1 school it would satisfy the "Non-clinical service work" portion?

Absolutely not.

You should be engaging in service to others less fortunate than yourself. And get away from any campus, and get out of your comfort zone.

 

[eigen]

Absolutely not.

You should be engaging in service to others less fortunate than yourself. And get away from any campus, and get out of your comfort zone.

I mean... Title 1 does suggest the OP is working primarily with students who are (presumably) less fortunate than themselves. It's employment, but it's employment focused on working with students at or below the poverty line, and depending on the OP, probably quite a lot of work with out of class needs and concerns (food, safe housing, etc.).

I would still suggest the OP find service opportunities outside of their profession, but I wouldn't consider this any different than, say, Teach for America or AmericaCorps in that it's employment focused on public service to those who need it.

 

[LizzyM]

Your role as a teacher could be tagged as "employment, non-clinical" or "teaching/tutoring". Either would be correct. It would be a crazy stretch (or even fraud) to call it "volunteer, non-clinical". Try to devote an average of an hour per week (it could be a half day once a month) with a community service organization doing food prep/distribution, outreach to the unhoused, anything like that.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

One thing that came to mind... Do you think since my 4 year teaching career has been at a title 1 school it would satisfy the "Non-clinical service work" portion?

It's classified as employment in my book, but I also will credit you with service orientation for this activity because you're not just working with the students in this scenario. You get some insights working in partnership with families and administration under constraints that most who tutor/mentor do not immerse themselves with. I know plenty of folks who substitute/teach in similar Tier 1/2 schools and hate it because of the lack of discipline or culture where learning is not rewarded.

 

[Goro]

One thing that came to mind... Do you think since my 4 year teaching career has been at a title 1 school it would satisfy the "Non-clinical service work" portion?

My apologies. I confused Title I with Division I.

 

[Moko]

Your role as a teacher could be tagged as "employment, non-clinical" or "teaching/tutoring". Either would be correct. It would be a crazy stretch (or even fraud) to call it "volunteer, non-clinical". Try to devote an average of an hour per week (it could be a half day once a month) with a community service organization doing food prep/distribution, outreach to the unhoused, anything like that.

I agree with the above responses. If someone miscategorized something like that, I would certainly see the entire application in a more negative light.

 

[DrPepperr]

1 start volunteering with patients
2 shadow doctors to the tune of 50 hrs total

Read my post on reinvention for premeds.

Is "volunteering with patients" the same as a visitation volunteer?

 

[Goro]

Is "volunteering with patients" the same as a visitation volunteer?

Please define visitation volunteer ..I'm not familiar with the term

 

[DrPepperr]

Please define visitation volunteer ..I'm not familiar with the term

I was looking up volunteer opportunities in my area and saw this...

Visitation Volunteer​

Any day, 9 a.m.-7 p.m.
Some of our volunteers function as ambassadors of goodwill by visiting and interacting with patients, families and staff. A smiling face and caring attitude can make all the difference for those who are ill and alone. Visiting volunteers often bring encouragement, hope and joy to patients who might otherwise have no visitors.

 

[LizzyM]

If you are face-to-face with patients, it is a clinical experience. If you are not being paid, it is a volunteer experience.

Looks like you have a winner.

 

[DrPepperr]

If you are face-to-face with patients, it is a clinical experience. If you are not being paid, it is a volunteer experience.

Looks like you have a winner.

Even if my sense of smell isn't great? JK thank you!

 

[DrPepperr]

So after pulling up my transcript, I have achieved the following:

Biology 1 w lab - B+
Bio 2 w lab- C +
Bio 3 w lab - C
Chem 1, lab - B, B
Chem 2, lab - C+, B+
Physics 1, lab - B, B
Physics 2, lab - C, B+
Organic 1, lab - C, C+
Organic 2, lab - C+ , B

Other relevant courses:

Ecology - C+
Medical Terminology - A-
Genetics - C
Physiology - C
Environmental Toxicology - C+

1) Do I meet all the prerequisite course requirements?

2) Since my overall undergrad GPA is a low 2.59, the post-bacc/SMP/DIY post-bacc would just be serving as a GPA boost/reinvention in which I would just take upper level science courses and not retake any of the courses I listed since I earned C's or above. Correct?

 

[Nontrad_FL_LGBT]

1) add biochem and you're good everywhere
2) yup

 

[Goro]

1) add biochem and you're good everywhere
2) yup

Agree

 

[Mr.Smile12]

I concur. You could look for SMPs: see if they require biochem or microbio.

Make sure your clinical experience is sewn up. It will be hard to juggle with SMP courses.

 

[DrPepperr]

Thank you to everyone that has contributed here. Just after a few days of research I have a much better understanding of what steps I would need to take. Thank you all so much.

I am currently trying to figure out what would best serve me in regards to a formal post-bacc vs DIY vs SMP.
A couple things on my mind:
1) Is a "formal post-bacc" a medical specific program? If so, if I want to stay in Florida, then FAU and Miami are the only options. Correct?
2) Does it really matter which of the three I choose as long as I do well in them? Or is there a consensus that one is better than the other?

Any information that would help me decide would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

Thank you to everyone that has contributed here. Just after a few days of research I have a much better understanding of what steps I would need to take. Thank you all so much.

I am currently trying to figure out what would best serve me in regards to a formal post-bacc vs DIY vs SMP.
A couple things on my mind:
1) Is a "formal post-bacc" a medical specific program? If so, if I want to stay in Florida, then FAU and Miami are the only options. Correct?
2) Does it really matter which of the three I choose as long as I do well in them? Or is there a consensus that one is better than the other?

Any information that would help me decide would be greatly appreciated.

You'll get a lot of input and feedback in the Postbac forums. Search through Postbaccalaureate Programs

 

[AJS59]

Thank you to everyone that has contributed here. Just after a few days of research I have a much better understanding of what steps I would need to take. Thank you all so much.

I am currently trying to figure out what would best serve me in regards to a formal post-bacc vs DIY vs SMP.
A couple things on my mind:
1) Is a "formal post-bacc" a medical specific program? If so, if I want to stay in Florida, then FAU and Miami are the only options. Correct?
2) Does it really matter which of the three I choose as long as I do well in them? Or is there a consensus that one is better than the other?

Any information that would help me decide would be greatly appreciated.

Oftentimes the post-bacc's are associated with medical schools but not always.

As you identified, as long as you do well you'll be set. The big difference mainly is cost incurred. With a DIY post-bacc you only take the classes you need, whereas the formal and SMP carry many more classes with them. A formal post-bacc will oftentimes offer courses in upper level bio and biomedical concepts whereas an SMP oftentimes takes after the first year of medical school.

My personal thought is given the low GPA (and need to take Biochem) an SMP would be the best option — If you do well you'll show mastery of the beginning parts of medical education. But as said above by Mr. Smile, you will be better served asking in the postbacc forum.

 

[chilly_md]

Thank you to everyone that has contributed here. Just after a few days of research I have a much better understanding of what steps I would need to take. Thank you all so much.

I am currently trying to figure out what would best serve me in regards to a formal post-bacc vs DIY vs SMP.
A couple things on my mind:
1) Is a "formal post-bacc" a medical specific program? If so, if I want to stay in Florida, then FAU and Miami are the only options. Correct?
2) Does it really matter which of the three I choose as long as I do well in them? Or is there a consensus that one is better than the other?

Any information that would help me decide would be greatly appreciated.

Goro’s guide to reinvention for your convenience:

Goro's advice for pre-meds who need reinvention

So you want to be a doctor, but your GPA is terrible. Is that the end? Rule #1: Take a deep breath, and stop fussing. The sky is not falling. But you are going to need to reinvent yourself. This will take both time and money. And always remember that you’re in a marathon now, not a sprint...

forums.studentdoctor.net

 

[DrPepperr]

Created a rough timeline for if I decide to go for it. Just thought I'd post it in this thread.

PHASE 1: From June to August

• Clinical work/ volunteer
• Non-clinical service work
• MCAT prep

PHASE 2: From August to December

• Take missing biochem pre req at local university and ace it
• Clinical work/ volunteer
• Non-clinical service work
• MCAT prep

PHASE 3: From December to May 2025

• Take MCAT. Crush it.
• Clinical work/ volunteer
• Shadowing

PHASE 4: May to August

• Enroll in SMP
• Clinical work/ volunteer
• Shadowing

PHASE 5: August to August 2026

• SMP. Perform well.
• Apply to med school (May)

PHASE 6: August to August 2027

• 1st choice - Med school year 1
• 2nd choice - Continue to do clinical work and shadow then reapply.

 

[AJS59]

Created a rough timeline for if I decide to go for it. Just thought I'd post it in this thread.

PHASE 1: From June to August

• Clinical work/ volunteer
• Non-clinical service work
• MCAT prep

PHASE 2: From August to December

• Take missing biochem pre req at local university and ace it
• Clinical work/ volunteer
• Non-clinical service work
• MCAT prep

PHASE 3: From December to May 2025

• Take MCAT. Crush it.
• Clinical work/ volunteer
• Shadowing

PHASE 4: May to August

• Enroll in SMP
• Clinical work/ volunteer
• Shadowing

PHASE 5: August to August 2026

• SMP. Perform well.

PHASE 6: August to August 2027

• 1st choice - Med school year 1
• 2nd choice - Continue to do clinical work and shadow then reapply.

Sorry, when in this timeline are you applying? May 2026?

 

[DrPepperr]

Sorry, when in this timeline are you applying? May 2026?

Yes. Hoping to find a SMP with good linkage.

 

[AJS59]

I'm not sure your timeline quite works in that case; for instance, should you apply to Loyola's MS in Medical Physiology their "guaranteed interview" only happens after graduation from the MSMP program. That may cause you to adjust your timeline on when to apply and/or when to go hit the MCAT. I am also not an expert and that was the first program I saw listed online so others may vary.

I also assume you intend to apply to more than just the school with the linkage? Schools with guaranteed acceptances are rare, but many will offer a guaranteed interview. If so, those schools (mainly MD) will want to see how did in your entire SMP (i.e. after you've graduated).

 

[DrPepperr]

I'm not sure your timeline quite works in that case; for instance, should you apply to Loyola's MS in Medical Physiology their "guaranteed interview" only happens after graduation from the MSMP program. That may cause you to adjust your timeline on when to apply and/or when to go hit the MCAT. I am also not an expert and that was the first program I saw listed online so others may vary.

I also assume you intend to apply to more than just the school with the linkage? Schools with guaranteed acceptances are rare, but many will offer a guaranteed interview. If so, those schools (mainly MD) will want to see how did in your entire SMP (i.e. after you've graduated).

Yes, I have realized the issue of needing to graduate SMP before a MS will consider my application. That is why at the end of the timeline I included "option 2" which is basically a gap year from SMP graduation to MS. (Making the MS application more realistically May 2027)

The issue with the MCAT is that from my understanding any worthwhile SMP will require an MCAT score. So yes, I will need to time that well so my score doesn't expire. (Maybe June 2025)

 

[AJS59]

Yes, I have realized the issue of needing to graduate SMP before a MS will consider my application. That is why at the end of the timeline I included "option 2" which is basically a gap year from SMP graduation to MS. (Making the MS application more realistically May 2027)

The issue with the MCAT is that from my understanding any worthwhile SMP will require an MCAT score. So yes, I will need to time that well so my score doesn't expire. (Maybe June 2025)

Good to see you're thinking through all of this!