Carle Foundation Hospital OMFS

[Bifid Uvula]

I've got a friend asking me about a program, and I'm not sure what to tell him.
Does anybody know anything about CFH OMFS program... Urbana, IL
www.carleconnect.com

cheers...

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[bitecys]

I've got a friend asking me about a program, and I'm not sure what to tell him.
Does anybody know anything about CFH OMFS program... Urbana, IL
www.carleconnect.com

cheers...

I externed at Carle for a week this summer. Dr. Bailey the head of the residency program is a dual degree (from MGH) and had a year of microvascular surgery fellowship. Needless to say, they do a lot of things there that most OMFS wouldn't do in private practice. The OMFS dept does almost all of the tracheostomies in the hospital, they do a lot of skin cancer, as well as get in on a large number of hemi-mandibulectomy and radical neck dissections/pec flaps. There are two other attendings at the main hospital (Dr. Goldwasser, a dual degree from Iowa, and Dr. Sable who did his residency at Carle). They do a good number of orthognathic cases as well

Carle is a level I trauma center so they have a fair amt of mandibles and mid-faces...no oto residency program there so you don't compete with other depts for trauma.

I felt their weakest area was dentoalveolar and implants as you are treating your attending's patients and often the attending does one side, and the resident does the other.

 

[Bifid Uvula]

Are the residents getting to take part in the expanded scope stuff?

 

[Energon]

The expanded scope of the residency sounds really neat. However, I imagine that the bread and butter that an OMFS (especially a single degree) makes in practice is from dentoalveolar surgery. These days its probably a whole lot more profitable to indulge in dentoalveolar surgery anywyas.

 

[OMFSCardsFan]

I imagine that the bread and butter that an OMFS (especially a single degree) makes in practice is from dentoalveolar surgery.

Dentoalveolar, thirds, and implants are the bread and butter for single- AND dual-degree oral surgeons. Coming from a guy in a dual-degree program, single degree guys have just as much experience doing the other aspects of OMS as well. Six-year guys just spend the extra two years doing med school BS. They don't really spend two extra years doing more complex, amazing oral surgery. The MD/DDS vs. DDS is a complicated topic, but right out of residency, a whole lot more (speaking of operating skill/experience) depends on where you go as opposed to what degree you achieved.

 

[Bifid Uvula]

Totally agreed... This whole dual/single degree thing isn't what distinguishes someone as an excellent maxillofacial surgeon. Having the MD is usually more of a "personal goal" and it does help in some "professional/political" settings... ie. Fellowship/Academia/and some hospital priveleges....

Thankfully most Dual Degree guys I know get along very well with the single degree guys (and visa versa). There is plenty of work to go around for everyone! Sometimes too much!

Anyway, i'm gonna go get 30 mins of shut-eye before I start pre-rounding. Today has been the day of LEFT Orbital Fxs and Lacerations. Must be the moon or something!

Keep some info coming on Carle if you can. I've heard some good things about them as well... sounds like a sleeper-powerhouse. I told my buddy to apply (it can't hurt).

 

[bitecys]

Keep some info coming on Carle if you can. I've heard some good things about them as well... sounds like a sleeper-powerhouse. I told my buddy to apply (it can't hurt).

The week I was there, I the extern, the chief, and Dr. Bailey (along with a straggling ENT and med student) tag-teamed the 10 hr hemi-mandibulectomy, rt radical neck dissection, left modified neck dissection, and right pec flap, so yes, the residents do get to do a lot of the expanded scope stuff. The residents felt they were extremely competent in managing skin due to the large amount of skin cancer they remove.

One of the other attendings is big on clefts, so they do a lot of secondary cleft closures, sphincteroplasties, etc.

 

[FCIllini]

I'm just a pre-dent so I can't help you in regards to the program itself, but could offer some insight as to Champaign-Urbana. I lived there for the first 20 years of my life.

It's a great college town & U of I has a beautiful campus. The city's growing, so there are becoming more things to do, but still mainly bars, few clubs, and cornfields. It's tough not to get caught up in Illini sports (assuming they have a decent season). You are about two hours away from Chicago & 1 1/2 hours away from Indianapolis.

Though from what I have heard from OMS residents, doesn't seem like there's much free time anyways.

 

[Energon]

Sorry you guys misunderstood me. I didnt mean that single or dual degree are inferior/superior in any way. I have just observed from most of our graduating residents that the 6 year folks sometimes tend to to other fellowships and stuff to dabble in cosmetics and other aspects of practice. The 4 year grads usually tend to build their practices around dentoalveolar procedures. I personally want to do a 4 year program.
Nonetheless, I want to come back to the previous point, its really great to do all the expanded stuff... especially the craniofacial and surgical oncology; however, does this mean that the program may be lacking in other aspects of oral surgery like dentoalveolar, preprosthetic, implants etc? or do you guys think that as residents you learn all of those things regardless even if the exposure is comparitively low to other programs?

 

[toofache32]

Dentoalveolar, thirds, and implants are the bread and butter for single- AND dual-degree oral surgeons. Coming from a guy in a dual-degree program, single degree guys have just as much experience doing the other aspects of OMS as well. Six-year guys just spend the extra two years doing med school BS. They don't really spend two extra years doing more complex, amazing oral surgery. The MD/DDS vs. DDS is a complicated topic, but right out of residency, a whole lot more (speaking of operating skill/experience) depends on where you go as opposed to what degree you achieved.

What he said. The piggy-bank is sitting right behind the 2nd molar, regardless of how many letters you have after your name.

 

[OMFSCardsFan]

I have just observed from most of our graduating residents that the 6 year folks sometimes tend to to other fellowships and stuff to dabble in cosmetics and other aspects of practice. The 4 year grads usually tend to build their practices around dentoalveolar procedures. I personally want to do a 4 year program.

I'm in a six-year program, and I intend to go right into private practice. There's a slight chance that I would look into a cosmetics or craniofacial fellowship, but only for additional private practice experience, not in the pursuit of a life in academia. When I was trying to decide between the two, not really understanding the intricacies of each, I decided that I would rather spend the extra two years now and end up not really "needing" the MD rather than looking back later and wishing that I would have gotten it when I had the opportunity.

 

[tx oms]

Coming from a guy in a dual-degree program, single degree guys have just as much experience doing the other aspects of OMS as well.

Shouldn't that say "coming from a guy 11 week out of dental school who isn't even allowed to extract thirds by himself"?

 

[OMFSCardsFan]

Shouldn't that say "coming from a guy 11 week out of dental school who isn't even allowed to extract thirds by himself"?

So, so jealous that as an intern, you had to ask for help way more often than I have. I heard all about your intern year. There was that ONE time so far that I've asked for your assistance. I might ask more often, but watching someone work on a single tooth (untouched by me) for 45 minutes isn't exactly what I'd call positive reinforcement.

By the way, to save you the trouble, I've already signed up for Q1 call...heh heh...

 

[tx oms]

So, so jealous that as an intern, you had to ask for help way more often than I have. I heard all about your intern year.

In your first and only month you asked me for help three times. Give it time. I'm not sure what lies you heard about my intern year. The only people that worked with me as an intern are omsres and the current fifth year resident. I think omsres can back-up the fact that I didn't get help anymore than anyother intern. Still, the mark of a smart resident is knowing when to ask for help. Remember that.

Forget the Q1 call. Also, forget about asking me or north2south for help next month. We'll be operating while you're monkeying around the clinic. That's punishment enough.

 

[omfsres]

So, so jealous that as an intern, you had to ask for help way more often than I have. I heard all about your intern year. There was that ONE time so far that I've asked for your assistance. I might ask more often, but watching someone work on a single tooth (untouched by me) for 45 minutes isn't exactly what I'd call positive reinforcement.

By the way, to save you the trouble, I've already signed up for Q1 call...heh heh...

Remember son, what you need a handpiece for, I flip out with a #9 periosteal elevator. When you get 2000 fmx's and 60 sets of thirds behind you I may elevate your status to Hygienist level. Even that is being generous, but you did win my annual first intern to do a rectal exam award so I'll cut you some slack.

 

[OMFSCardsFan]

Even that is being generous, but you did win my annual first intern to do a rectal exam award so I'll cut you some slack.

You know, I try to do TX a favor by helping him to remove that Coke bottle from his rectum, and all I get is abuse. The next time that you two "experiment," refrain from the alcohol so you can remove it yourself.

 

[esclavo]

I've got a friend asking me about a program, and I'm not sure what to tell him.
Does anybody know anything about CFH OMFS program... Urbana, IL
www.carleconnect.com

cheers...

I know some guys there. They have run of the place. No other surgical residencies except for Colorectal surgery. I heard that one attending trained at MGH/Maryland (OMFS-head and neck oncology/microvascular surgery-he is listed in the FACS member catalog) and he runs the head and neck tumor board. There is another older guy that is the head of the cleft lip/palate team (certified cl/cp team) and plastics/ent don't even participate except to do PE tubes. These two guys did the last clinics on skin cancer. They say they treat over 1700 cases of just skin CA per year. I heard aside from Zide down in Texas, these guys are doing more skin CA than any other OMFS in the country. The guys say it is private practice hospital so it takes a year to gain there trust and really get going. Sounds like they practice an extremely wide scope for a four year program. Has anyone heard anything else about Tennessee? I heard that they have run of the place where they are at too.

 

[toofache32]

Has anyone heard anything else about Tennessee? I heard that they have run of the place where they are at too.

Which Tennessee? Knoxville, Memphis, Vanderbilt, Meharry?