AZCOM Class of 2009

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medtraveler said:
Aloha Kid,

Thanks for the solid insight and encouragement. Just curious to how early we should start lining up third year rotations. I'll be in Phoenix for the summer and I was thinking if I spent some time shadowing or volunteering at competitive rotation sights here in the valley I might be able to make some connections and maybe prop open a few doors when the time comes to apply for rotations. I suppose what I'm asking is how early is too early. Any thoughts? Congratulations with the recent match.


I think about half way through your second year, the school will start to schedule some of your 3rd year rotations. Once you have an idea of what is set up for you and what is not, then you can kind of begin to get an idea of what you like and don't like. The school will set up all your rotations if you want. However, if you are like most of my class, many of us did schedule 1 or more rotaions on our own and many of us did go out of state as well. The reasons vary.

I'm not sure if making connections before school would help. I would shadow for the purpose of exposure, but not so much trying to establish connections. It's not about connections at this point, but about hospital policies and contracts. Difficult to explain. I will need to take more time later on to talk about this more.

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As an AZCOM grad 2003, it gives all that you will need and more...Remember medicine is all about life long learning. If you want to be lazy, guess what you can, if you want to work hard and learn you can. If you want to do all your rotations in the AZCOm system and get a match wherever you want, you can. If you want to spend extra money and go out you can. Your choice.
Have fun, AZCOM rocks. To see more details look at my old messages
 
Holy ****, Isnt this a thread for 2009 students? I was really pumped to come to MWU a few months ago, and now I finally have an acceptance and I see a thread full of bitching and moaning students? Why dont you guys join a chat room, start another thread, have a boxing match? Lets try and stay focused on the positive aspects of school, atleast till we start school and end any normal life we had. I appreciate the heads up, but you guys need to chill, really!

Just wanted to give a shout out to the incomming class! Think Im flying down in a couple weeks to check out apts. Be back with an update!
 
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bjay27,

I agree! Welcome to the class and I look forward to meeting you in the fall. By the way, I'll be visiting some friends in Seattle coming up in June. Any suggestions on cool things to see? PM me.

-Matt
 
Hey all, welcome to AZCOM. I used to stay pretty up to date on this site but it has been a while since I have read (or posted) anything. I just spent the last hour and a half reading this entire thread and wow, some pretty strong opinions. Sorry for the detour. I hope nobody was scared off. I'm just a first year student and I don't have a lot of experience yet, but overall I have been very happy with my decision to come here. I hope that doesn't change anytime soon.

Earlier somebody mentioned the big brother/big sister program. All assignments have been made and as of now your older sibling should have all of your names and e-mail addresses, and it is up to them when (and if) they contact you. Some students are less than enthusiastic about it and you may never hear from them. (I still to this day have no idea who mine is.) Hopefully all of you have received a letter from the MSI student council with a list of our names and e-mail addresses so that you can contact any of us with any questions you may have. This is something that we decided to do this year because the big bro/sis program doesn't always work. If you didn't get it, call the admissions office and ask if they will send you one. If they don't know what you're talking about, PM me and I'll send it to you.

Again, sorry this thread got overrun for a while. If anybody has any questions that are a little more pertinent to your current situation, (i.e. housing, insurance, books, schedules, etc...) feel free to ask. I'm married with two kids and I live across the street from the school in the Arrowhead Highlands apartments (just to give you some perspective of where I'm coming from). I'll try to do a better job of staying up to date here.

Take care and congratulations. You should be proud of yourselves.
 
Just yesterday my "big brother" contacted me. I sent him an e-mail asking a ton of questions so he'll really have his hands full with me :D . One thing I've noticed from talking with AZCOM students and browsing on SDN is that it seems like there are quite a few students who are married and have kids. Being a single male with no kids in the foreseeable future, will I be in the minority?
 
crys20 said "Not to sound like a complete idiot...But if you go away from Phoenix for a 4 or 6 week block for a certain rotation 3rd year, where do you live?? "
Alohakid answered this, I believe.

"From all of this, I gather that 4th year runs more smoothly, and you can do your work in Phoenix hospitals?"
Yes - as it stands now, though, you need the hospital experience in your 3rd year to get in to the hospitals in your 4th year in Phoenix. (Not necessarily the case in the rest of the country, though.) So I don't know what Dean Cole has said, or how the system is going to work next year, but as it stands right now, you pretty much MUST travel in your 3rd year to do the rotations in your 4th year in Phoenix.

"I gather that when interviewing for residencies more would like to see that you did traditional hospital-based rotations rather than the preceptor model that AZCOM offers? And if this is true, the thing to do would be to arrange these rotations on your own 3rd year, perform well and get your LOR?"

Locally, all the programs here know the way the system is set up. I was asked what sort of hospital rotations I did when I interviewd at Phx Children's, but when I interviewed out of state, no one cared or knew the system. I have a friend who interviewed at Good Sam in Phx and was sort of asked the same thing but in not as nice a way.

I think, you really need to get your feet wet in a hospital setting. If you can't travel, or the school doesnt set up those hospital based rotations they are claiming to do in your 3rd year, you really need to do as many rotations as you can with a hospitalist. You need to get a feel for the hospital - how it all works - how to deal with nurses, the lab, etc.

The most importatn thing is to get GOOD LORs. I asked for them when I did well on a rotation. Realize, though, that some people, while good doctors, aren't such great writers. So you want to get as many LORs as you can. No one cared (except here at Phx Children's) where they came from.

"If you're just calling programs on your own as one little student trying to get a 4 or 6 week or whatever rotation in whatever...I'm confused...Would you be calling programs that are going to have other students rotating as well? Like say you call up MCO in Toledo and want to do your 6 week surg rotation...Are you going to be doing the standard rotation setup amongst the MCO students? So I guess my point is you'd be rotating in an established sort of 3rd year student program? "

There are 3rd year rotations, and then there are 4th year Senior electives. People all over the country are calling for 4th year senior electives, so that is no big deal. As far as the 3rd year rotations go, it is generally easier to set them up at an Osteopathic teaching facility that takes other DO students, like St Vincent's in Toledo, for example. Again, it's not that big of a deal, because they get students calling them all the time. As a 3rd year, you'd be doing a standard rotation like other 3rd years.

"I'm sorry for all these silly questions...Just trying to educate myself more about AZCOM as a prospective student.."

Dude - that's what this place is for! Your questions are totally legit!

kristin
AZCOM class of 2005
 
Inquiringmind24 said:
One thing I've noticed from talking with AZCOM students and browsing on SDN is that it seems like there are quite a few students who are married and have kids. Being a single male with no kids in the foreseeable future, will I be in the minority?

No. My guess is that's it's about 60/40 in favor of the single guys. I think one of the reasons that there are a lot of married guys here is that there are simply a lot of older guys. I think the average age in our class is about 27 or so. Trust me though, there are plenty of single guys (and single girls) that get together and go out on the weekends. You'll have fun.
 
larke28 said:
Speaking of SGA, how is that and other membership organizations taken into account during match? I was looking at list of AZCOM organizations and there are so many i'd like to join. How much time do current students have for time commitments to clubs? Any recommendations of particular clubs for incoming students who are unsure of the branch of medicine they're interested in? (personally, i'm leaning toward emergency med)
I can't speak for how things get taken into consideration as far as being accepted into a residency, but I agree that there are a lot of organizations that you can choose from. During the second or third week of school they have what's called club week where you'll have an opportunity to join any club (or clubs) that you want to. Don't feel pressured to join anything if you don't really want to. And don't feel pressured to sign up that week if you want to take some time to think about it. (I'm sure you can join any club at any time during the year).

Some of the organizations that the majority of the students are a part of are SOMA (student osteopathic medical association), AMSA (american medical student association), and the AMA (american medical association). They do a lot of good things on behalf of the students, and with membership in some of them you get a free Netter's atlas (very helpful for anatomy).

As far as specialty clubs go (Peds, EM, surgery, etc...) I would say to sign up for those that you are thinking you might go into. Most of the time the presidency for the next year is chosen from the members of the current year. Clubs really aren't that much of a time committment, especially for the first years. Most activities consist of guest speakers at lunch, workshops in the evening, or an occasional health fair once in a while.

You can also get involved in student government as well. The MSI student council has about 10 or 11 positions. Elections are usually held somewhere around 4 or 5 weeks into your first quarter.

Anyway, like anything else in life you can be as much or as little involved as you want to. Just a quick piece of common sense advice, make sure you've got a good handle on your classes before you get too involved in extracurricular activities. You don't want to be failing out of school because you got talked into signing up for all 30 or so clubs and are trying to go to all of the activities.
 
hi everyone, thanks for all the helpful answers! another question, what happens during the 3 days of orientation? and curious why the white coat ceremony is in the middle of Q2? Also, with the Christmas holidays right in the middle of Q2, do you actually get a break, or end up studying during the holidays? (i've gotten too used to being on semester schedule)
 
I think the white coat ceremony isn't until Q2 since it will be too hot to have it in August. And correct me if I'm wrong, orientation begins on August 24th right?
 
larke28 said:
hi everyone, thanks for all the helpful answers! another question, what happens during the 3 days of orientation?

During orientation you sit through a lot of meetings and get introduced to a lot of people who work around campus. You're not expected to do much of anything other than show up. Two of the more important presentations you will get are about student insurance and diagnostic equipment. Every student is required to carry health insurance, and I've heard that the school is really going to push you guys to buy the schools health insurance plan. The idea being that the more people they have buy into it, the cheaper it will be. You will also get pressured to order all of your equipment during the first week. You will get told that you are absolutely required to have it all for the first week of Dr. Schwartz's Introduction to Clinical Medicine class. The truth is the only thing that you really need is a stethescope. If you want to buy everything then that is fine, most people do. I've got a good friend here who didn't buy anything. He just uses his stethescope that he already had and he has gotten along just fine.

larke28 said:
and curious why the white coat ceremony is in the middle of Q2?

The white coat ceremony is in December mainly because of the weather. Apparently they used to have it earlier in the year but it was so hot that everybody was just miserable. Ours was the first week of December and the weather was awesome.

larke28 said:
Also, with the Christmas holidays right in the middle of Q2, do you actually get a break, or end up studying during the holidays? (i've gotten too used to being on semester schedule)

Yes you will (or should) end up studying over Christmas break. The faculty are all pretty cool and they are really good to work out a test schedule that works well with the vacation schedule. In the end, though, they can only do the best they can and more than likely you will end up having a test just a couple of days after you get back. (We had a Physiology test the wednesday after we got back). You won't need to put in a ton of time over the break, but it would be a good idea to be caught up when you get back.
 
Thought there were some pretty interesting articles about medical school in the latest isssue of NEJM. If you dont have access to these links for some reason, I can e-mail you.


Becoming a Physician: Notes to the Class — First Day
K. Treadway

http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/352/19/1943?query=TOC
An Audio Interview with Dr. Katharine Treadway on teaching compassion to medical students
http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/352/19/1943/DC1?query=TOC

Becoming a Physician: MSL — Medicine as a Second Language
R.K. Sobel

http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/352/19/1945

When do MSII students start?
 
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bjay27 said:
Thought there were some pretty interesting articles about medical school in the latest isssue of NEJM. If you dont have access to these links for some reason, I can e-mail you.


Becoming a Physician: Notes to the Class — First Day
K. Treadway

http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/352/19/1943?query=TOC
An Audio Interview with Dr. Katharine Treadway on teaching compassion to medical students
http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/352/19/1943/DC1?query=TOC

Becoming a Physician: MSL — Medicine as a Second Language
R.K. Sobel

http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/full/352/19/1945

When do MSII students start?


MSIIs usually begin the same day that MSIs start class (not including orientation).
 
Has anyone who will be living on campus received their assignment yet? I think Jose Ponce told me it would be mailed mid to late June but I can't remember exactly. Also, any word on financial aid award letters?
 
Inquiringmind24 said:
Has anyone who will be living on campus received their assignment yet? I think Jose Ponce told me it would be mailed mid to late June but I can't remember exactly. Also, any word on financial aid award letters?

Financial aid awards are still waiting for next year's cost of attendence i.e. tuition to be set.

As far as housing goes give Jose a call and ask him if you've received campus housing. I called him and from what I gather he can probably tell people if they will have housing but nothing about the specific assignments yet.
 
Inquiringmind24 said:
Has anyone who will be living on campus received their assignment yet? I think Jose Ponce told me it would be mailed mid to late June but I can't remember exactly. Also, any word on financial aid award letters?

Matt,

I stopped by the financial aid office a few days ago and it sounds like we should be getting the first disbursement of our federal loans on September 2nd. Hylacinerea might have mentioned this as well but once they decide on how much they are going to tweak the tuition this year we should get our award letters. It seems rather late in the year to still not have a set tuition for this upcoming year.

Just a thought...does anyone know if the increase is dictated by the collective financial needs of the university or specifically by the needs of the college of osteopathic medicine?



"I'll tell you the secret to how I achieved my goal. My strength lies solely in tenacity."
- Louis Pasteur
 
Thanks for the info Jason! I'll be awaiting the award letter. That academic calender is daunting, I'll admit. We'd better appreciate those three days in between each quarter :D .
 
Inquiringmind24 said:
Thanks for the info Jason! I'll be awaiting the award letter. That academic calender is daunting, I'll admit. We'd better appreciate those three days in between each quarter :D .


Usually MSIs get 2 weeks off at Thanksgiving and Christmas, and then they get a week for Spring Break. Hope that your class has the same luxury, but I must admit that I haven't looked at the schedule yet.
 
Good luck y'all.

Tip for your first year: Hire a recorder/transcription person for the neuroanatomy lectures. Our class decided on forking out cash to a crop of our peers to record and transcribe the lectures. Was great come study time.

AZCOM profs generally give out great notes but nero notes are just an outline. Dr. Mihailoff is one brilliant guy. In retrospect HY neuroanatomy would be a nice guide to give you the big picture for what you are studying. Other than that the text given with the course is very readable.

Sneak into the nice resorts (Camelback, The Phonecian, The Princess, etc...) bring a book or two, kick back by the pool and do some reading, then grab a drink. One of the best things about the Scottsdale area.

I never lived on campus. Too creepy to be that close to the school.
 
medicine1 said:

Very interesting! Thanks for posting this article. As I read it I kept thinking of Michigan State. I think at MSU both DO and MD students take the same classes at least at first (obviously not including omm). The author has a good idea and it would probably help foster an even better relationship between the DO/MD worlds. However, I think the potential financial issues would be quite problematic. State tuition is much cheaper than azcom and it would not be very fair to have two different tuition rates for students taking the same classes. My answer to that is for azcom to lower the tuition since there will be more paying students and then the state could help subsidize the DO students too becasue as the author pointed out, this would be helping to increase the number of practicing physicians in the state. Ok enough day-dreaming for now. :sleep:
 
VentdependenT said:
Tip for your first year: Hire a recorder/transcription person for the neuroanatomy lectures. Our class decided on forking out cash to a crop of our peers to record and transcribe the lectures. Was great come study time.

AZCOM profs generally give out great notes but nero notes are just an outline. Dr. Mihailoff is one brilliant guy. In retrospect HY neuroanatomy would be a nice guide to give you the big picture for what you are studying. Other than that the text given with the course is very readable.
Our class didn't do this, and it was no big deal.
 
Hi. Anyone still looking for housing? I am in need of a roommate for a home in Arrowhead Lakes approx. 1mi from campus. I can provide more details if you email me at [email protected].
 
Hey All,

I'm looking for a few clean roomates to fill a spacious 4 bedroom 2 bath house. It is only 1.4 miles from campus and has a 3 car garage, pool, jacuzzi, sports court, and a park/basketball court across the street. Rent is 400 a month. Email me if you have questions: [email protected]. Thanks.
 
There was some argument about AZCOM getting access to Phoenix hospitals on this thread not too long ago. Looks like the nay-sayers were wrong. Where's Novacek88 now? :p :thumbdown:

http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/business/articles/0524midwestern24.html

Midwestern University gains access to hospitals

Jodie Snyder
The Arizona Republic
May. 24, 2005 12:00 AM

Every day, hundreds of students at Midwestern University, a large private medical school in Glendale, learn the finer points of human anatomy.

But Midwestern officials could give their own pointers about muscle - political muscle, that is.

The little-known school weighed in during the recent University of Arizona Phoenix medical school debate at the right time and extracted some long-coveted considerations from its rival. Both Midwestern and the UA train medical school students in Phoenix, but ever since Midwestern arrived nine years ago, it has argued that the UA blocked access to critical hospital spots for its students, which the UA denies.

The result of Midwestern recent efforts: More osteopath students will probably train in the Valley's largest hospitals, and Midwestern hopes more will stay and practice in the area.

Midwestern accomplished its goals by telling legislators it supported funding the UA medical school in Phoenix as long as Midwestern got access to scarce hospital spots for its third- and fourth-year students. The University of Arizona needed all the support it could muster to get funding for the medical school.

Arguing to legislators that the state needs more physicians, Midwestern persuaded state lawmakers to pass a law that hospitals can't be prohibited by a medical school from taking students from another school.

The passing of the law shows the political intricacies of educating doctors. It also comes at a time when the UA is trying to get its downtown Phoenix medical school up and running and other private medical schools are looking around in the Valley about moving here.

Located on a 150-acre campus, Midwestern offers four years of basic medical school classes, with the last two concentrated in clinical rotations through physician's offices and hospitals. Those rotations are key in the training for doctors-to-be.

There is a limited number of spots in the Valley for students to train in hospitals and UA students usually take them.

Unlike the UA, which trains allopathic physicians, Midwestern trains osteopaths, a type of physician that stresses holistic medicine. Over the past decades, allopathic medicine has overshadowed osteopathic; membership in the American Medical Association is far greater than membership in the osteopathic counterpart. Across the country, the rivalry between MDs and DOs has been intense but many say the acrimony between the two has died off.

Kathleen Goeppinger, Midwestern University's president, downplayed the rivalry as a reason for the lack of access to hospital rotations.

"The hospitals told us they didn't want to step on the UA's toes by offering the spots," she said.

Both Banner Good Samaritan Medical Center and St. Joseph's Hospital and Medical Center say they don't have any Midwestern third-year students because they have designed longstanding "defined curriculum" with the UA that makes it difficult to bring in students from other schools.

Banner says more than 30 percent of fourth-year students are from Midwestern. St. Joes says it varies around 20 percent.

Without more spots, 38 percent of Midwestern's 266 third- and fourth-year students went out of state for their training.

Midwestern told legislators that keeping those students would help create more Arizona physicians by encouraging students to remain here. But university officials say they don't know how many students decided not to return to Arizona because of the lack of spots.

With their latest legislative victory, Midwestern hopes to get its students into hospital rotations as early as fall.

Judy Bernas, associate vice president for federal relations for the UA, isn't so sure about that timetable, saying the UA wants to work with Midwestern but placing its own students appropriately has to be its first priority.

After a legislative battle, the UA got the money to educate 24 new students a year in Phoenix. It wants to eventually have 150 students a year in Phoenix. The UA already has 80 to 100 third- and fourth-year students in rotations in Phoenix.

The UA pays the hospital some of the training costs for those third- and fourth-year students.

Midwestern residents, medical students who have graduated, don't face problems getting into hospital spots, unlike their third- and fourth-year counterparts, Goeppinger said.

Unlike a medical-school program, hospitals pick their own residents.

Nor did the school's about 900 pharmacy students find any problems in getting hospital rotations. The school has 507 pharmacy graduates, and 384 current students.

"They were so desperate, they came to our door begging for our students," she said.

The medical-school debate has helped put a spotlight on Midwestern, which has been growing steadily over the past nine years.

In 1996, when Midwestern, which has trained osteopathic students for more than 100 years near Chicago, decided to open a second campus in the Valley there was no discussion of a physician shortage in Arizona.

The non-profit Midwestern, which has $245 million in assets, decided the area provided opportunities to train students and serve patients.

It has grown to be a large academic campus, complete with living quarters. The campus also trains other health care professionals such as physician assistants and occupational therapists. It also offers a program for perfusionists, who are trained to operate heart and lung machines and recently began a program to train nurse anesthetists, one of the most in-demand health care professions.

It is also starting a podiatry program and is looking at bringing clinical psychology to campus as well.

Goeppinger says Midwestern is thinking about developing a nursing school. The community colleges do a good job in training entry-level nurses but there is a need for more advanced programs, she said.
 
Interesting article. It really shows how much politics are involved in medical education. I would guess this bodes well for current and future AZCOM students.
 
New tuition rate just came out; went up the full 7%. OUCH! At this rate we'll be paying over 45K in tuition our last year. This is seriously ridiculous. The thing that really annoys me is that we're paying so much money partly so that MWU can open up more programs like nursing, podiatry, perfusion, etc., not that I don't think these are needed I just don't want to be the one to fund it. Gotta love private school huh?
 
Just back from MWU yesterday. New tuition rates are posted, yikes! 57K/yr with off-campus living :eek:
Good thing I landed an AF scholarship :D

For those un-interested in living in on-campus housing, because all the decent rms are taken, or your looking for something a little nicer, (or all I am looking for is a freakin washer and dryer). I checked out the two Mark Taylor apt. complexes accross the street from MWU. Yes, I was out in 105 heat, (coming from Seattle) and it wasnt too bad! The two places are either San Prado, and Arrowhead (highlands). The (brand new) San Prado lot is 1/2 the size of Arrowhead, but has a built in overhead carport (right at your apt.) really really nice pool, 24h fitness, pc room w/ fax copier 1bds are all on the bottom. Arrowhead is huge (380 apts.), larger fitness rm. with shower and sauna, sand beach pool, available copy fax, but shared with the office. Arrowhead also has a nice little moat arround everything, and since its older, they usually have monthly functions set up. Their 1bdrms are all on the 2nd floor (except for 4). Arrowhead has a white electric appliance/ countertop with maple cabinets while San Prado has black gas appliances with cherry cabinetry and red/gray marble looking countertops. Both start at $780 -20 for MWU per month for 1bdrms. Usually theres a movin special, and the Arrowhead lady said she'd give me 1/2 off my first months rent no matter what. PM me with any other questions, I havent decided which I like better. I do know that most MWU students live at Arrowhead. You need to get on a waiting list for Aug. at these places if your interested, everyone on the list has almost always gotten a rm., takes a $150 check, and this is refundable. PM me with any questions! Check out Rent.Com for more info on these.

I also looked at a place called Strayhorse arrowhead ranch, a couple mins from school, (b/c they have washer and dryers) and they have a decent place with great rates $680 for big ass 1bdrms, including sewer and water I think. I just want to be able to walk to class, so I didnt consider them!

When is everyone moving? I cant decide whether to come down at the beginning or mid of August? If some peeps want to party and hang during the calm before the storm, I'll be there earlier than later!
 
hylacinerea said:
New tuition rate just came out; went up the full 7%. OUCH! At this rate we'll be paying over 45K in tuition our last year. This is seriously ridiculous. The thing that really annoys me is that we're paying so much money partly so that MWU can open up more programs like nursing, podiatry, perfusion, etc., not that I don't think these are needed I just don't want to be the one to fund it. Gotta love private school huh?

Bastards jacked it up 6 and 7% every year I was there.....Thank God I finished in 4.....
 
hey, congrats on the scholarship! I'll probably be there early August. It'll be cool to check out the city/area with some ppl (hiking anyone?).

bjay27 said:
Just back from MWU yesterday. New tuition rates are posted, yikes! 57K/yr with off-campus living :eek:
Good thing I landed an AF scholarship :D

For those un-interested in living in on-campus housing, because all the decent rms are taken, or your looking for something a little nicer, (or all I am looking for is a freakin washer and dryer). I checked out the two Mark Taylor apt. complexes accross the street from MWU. Yes, I was out in 105 heat, (coming from Seattle) and it wasnt too bad! The two places are either San Prado, and Arrowhead (highlands). The (brand new) San Prado lot is 1/2 the size of Arrowhead, but has a built in overhead carport (right at your apt.) really really nice pool, 24h fitness, pc room w/ fax copier 1bds are all on the bottom. Arrowhead is huge (380 apts.), larger fitness rm. with shower and sauna, sand beach pool, available copy fax, but shared with the office. Arrowhead also has a nice little moat arround everything, and since its older, they usually have monthly functions set up. Their 1bdrms are all on the 2nd floor (except for 4). Arrowhead has a white electric appliance/ countertop with maple cabinets while San Prado has black gas appliances with cherry cabinetry and red/gray marble looking countertops. Both start at $780 -20 for MWU per month for 1bdrms. Usually theres a movin special, and the Arrowhead lady said she'd give me 1/2 off my first months rent no matter what. PM me with any other questions, I havent decided which I like better. I do know that most MWU students live at Arrowhead. You need to get on a waiting list for Aug. at these places if your interested, everyone on the list has almost always gotten a rm., takes a $150 check, and this is refundable. PM me with any questions! Check out Rent.Com for more info on these.

I also looked at a place called Strayhorse arrowhead ranch, a couple mins from school, (b/c they have washer and dryers) and they have a decent place with great rates $680 for big ass 1bdrms, including sewer and water I think. I just want to be able to walk to class, so I didnt consider them!

When is everyone moving? I cant decide whether to come down at the beginning or mid of August? If some peeps want to party and hang during the calm before the storm, I'll be there earlier than later!
 
Congrats!

This is another lowly MSII that thinks you make a great choice :). Gotta love being able to study all day any time of the year and still be able to see the sun and/or ride a bike to and from school.

I'm an older student in our class with two elementary school kids and a house about 2 miles East of campus. If I can answer any specific questions feel free to PM. Now that finals are over I should more active on SDN.

So, some thoughts/suggestions:

1) Start thinking about what you want to do next summer early. Summer research fellowships with faculty fill up fast, as do anatomy TAships (but they don't open up until Spring).

2) Don't worry too much about rotations yet. Things are changing for the better. You can get what you want and hopefully won't have to work as hard to get it as our predecessors. For example: even before the recnt legislative stuff Dean McWilliams acquired 14 ward-based IM rotations a month (3rd yr) for us a large hospital in Yuma. It is getting better.

3) The school is pretty proactive. As an example, this year's Topics class 3rd quarter was geared towards USMLE Step 1. For the first time, we had a class on the Biostats material that is traditionally only taught at Allo schools.

4) While I'm no expert, I'd like to clarify a couple things. We have always been able to rotate locally 4th year, but needed 8 wks ward-based (inpatient) rotation first that we couldn't get, even though rotation slots at UofA hospitals went empty. We will now (starting with Maricopa County) be able to fill those empty slots, primarily IM. Again, the school is working to improve things. Heck, it's in their best interest to!

5) I would encourage students to (after getting a handle on the studies) get active in clubs and student government. You've heard about the politics between UofA and AZCOM. Please realize this is at the Governor's and Administrator's level. I'm the VP for our AMA chapter and we're going to a Socs game in Chicago with the UofA officers at the national convention next month. In fact. our Prez is rooming with one of their officers.

6) As has been mentioned out faculty is pretty good. Anatomy and Neuro are simply outstanding. I think Dr. Mihailoff's Neuro class is the best organized and lectured class I ever attended (that includes B-school from a good instituion).

7) The students really are great. Take advantage of your Big Sis/Bro. Feel free PM me if they haven't contacted you yet and I will try to locate them or answer your questions. Our upperclassmen have been terrific. We'll do our best to continue their tradition. Get to know your class. Try studying with different groups/styles. First quarter is intentionally a little easier so you can do this.

8) If you want to save some money look for health insurance, books & med equipment now while you have time (I'm a huge Ebay fan!).

That's enough for now. Orientation is a kick. You made it!
 
Hey jgrady,

Thanks so much for that first year advice. It's really encouraging to know I will be attending a school with such helpful and supportive classmates. I'm still in a bind as to whether I should live on or off campus. For on campus, I already have a deposit down on a really cheap standard two bedroom apartment. But I've already seen reasonable prices on off campus places. Do you or anyone else know students who have lived in the standard two bedroom apartment with a roommate? Are they as cramped as I've been hearing? I really don't want to regret any housing decision I make, so any feedback would be greatly appreciated. :D
 
Inquiringmind24 said:
Hey jgrady,

Thanks so much for that first year advice. It's really encouraging to know I will be attending a school with such helpful and supportive classmates. I'm still in a bind as to whether I should live on or off campus. For on campus, I already have a deposit down on a really cheap standard two bedroom apartment. But I've already seen reasonable prices on off campus places. Do you or anyone else know students who have lived in the standard two bedroom apartment with a roommate? Are they as cramped as I've been hearing? I really don't want to regret any housing decision I make, so any feedback would be greatly appreciated. :D

I'm finishing up two years in a luxury 2br with vaulted ceilings and it's just big enough...from what I've seen of the standards, it would be tough going if you're the sort to study a lot in your apartment.

All in all, I've been very happy with on-campus housing; being able to stumble to a test in the morning is helpful. There are drawbacks...it's a little expensive, the "forum" architecture tends to amplify the screams of the dear but very numerous children, and despite the school's claims that you get free cable and internet, you in fact get *school* cable, which is poor man's basic, and internet via the school's ethernet system, which is by far the worst I've ever experienced.

Oh yeah, also! A picture I took right outside my apartment door last month:
http://www.kesil.com/bees.jpg

Hopefully that little issue is taken care of.

If I had to do it again I'd be split between the virtues of proximity and amenity (and actually, for those few who don't mind a drive from central phoenix, there are some awesome complexes in the art district). If I had to choose between off-campus and one of the standards, though, I'd personally go off-campus with no regrets.
 
I'll pipe in and answer a few questions as well. PM or just post...and I'll respond whenever I check SDN.

Lukewhite is absolutely right about the third floor vaulted ceilings....they are worth it.

for furniture:
1) check out http://phoenix.craigslist.org/
2) eBay (do an advanced search for the 85308 zip code)
3) garage sales in Scottsdale
4) Copenhagen Imports (must go the to the warehouse with "damaged" furniture) -- in most cases, there is hardly anything more than a cosmetic scratch that's not even visible..but will be 50% off.

for books:
1) don't buy them
2) okay, if buy them there are only a handful you will truly need
3) You will have a chance to get a free Netters Atlas at the beginning of the year

for medical equipment:
1) Take the time to handle both the Welch Allyn and Littman before buying a scope
2) You don't need everything they recommend...there are only a handful of things you need..and in dire situations you can get by without those too
3) don't buy anything early as Welch Allyn will come to the school and offer discounted prices

If getting a laptop:
1) get a portable laptop, not a desktop replacement
2) coupons good at dell:
$750 off $1899 Inspiron Notebooks code BF606XBVMFBG9L Exp 6/1
$600 off $1599 Inspiron Notebooks code 3QD9NPCTXP9?MH Exp 6/1
$500 off $1399 Inspiron Notebooks code N$K3$NR1ZNV4B0 Exp 6/1
3) check out http://www.fatwallet.com/c/18/ and keep an eye out for good laptop deals (as well as anything else you may want to purchase)

If you like watching TV:
1) Buy a TIVO. (you can use the fatwallet site to help search for one)
I'd recommend paying the lifetime fee over the monthly
There are sites out there that can show you how to replace the HD in your tivo so it will handle more hours (or sites you can send your tivo so it be done for you)

Student Loans & Fin Aid:
1) THE loans from www.northstar.org are the best option available
2) Don't forget to consolidate your loans (if eligible) before July 1st as rates are expected to rise
3) If you said you were interested in work study on your FAFSA, then you will be alloted $1000 of Federal WS...but the maximum amount of your private loan eligibility will be lowered by $1000. If you said you were not interested, your be able to take out $1000 in private loans over students who did choose that option.
4) It IS worth your time to figure who gives you the stafford loan and private loan options. Two students can take out the same amount of money in stafford + private loans...but both students will repay back different amounts due to the interest accrued...this difference could EASILY be $30,000 if not more.
 
Thanks for the feedback PoohChong and Luke. I guess I never though about the child noise factor. I'm so used to living in a college town where there really aren't too many kids around. As far as studying goes, I've always been the type who likes to study at the library so I really don't see that as a problem. The basic cable and slow internet connection are something to think about as well. I'll continue to weigh the pros and cons of each option...
 
LukeWhite said:
I'm finishing up two years in a luxury 2br with vaulted ceilings and it's just big enough...from what I've seen of the standards, it would be tough going if you're the sort to study a lot in your apartment.

All in all, I've been very happy with on-campus housing; being able to stumble to a test in the morning is helpful. There are drawbacks...it's a little expensive, the "forum" architecture tends to amplify the screams of the dear but very numerous children, and despite the school's claims that you get free cable and internet, you in fact get *school* cable, which is poor man's basic, and internet via the school's ethernet system, which is by far the worst I've ever experienced.

Oh yeah, also! A picture I took right outside my apartment door last month:
http://www.kesil.com/bees.jpg

Hopefully that little issue is taken care of.

If I had to do it again I'd be split between the virtues of proximity and amenity (and actually, for those few who don't mind a drive from central phoenix, there are some awesome complexes in the art district). If I had to choose between off-campus and one of the standards, though, I'd personally go off-campus with no regrets.

Thanks for all the info! Could you expand on the quality of the school internet? What makes it so bad, is it really slow? What's the deal with the numerous children? I was not expecting that one. I guess I just thought there wouldn't be that many people with kids here. Plus I figured people with kids would want to live off campus anyway. Hmmn, now I'm a little freaked out that I'll be moving into some sort of daycare complex with crappy internet and cable for about the same price as living off campus.
 
The cable is a mix between basic cable and standard cable.

The school can choose about 30 channels, so in addition to the regualar network channels you have espn, espn II, comedy central, mtv, mtvII, vh1, discovery, TNT....

For me, there aren't any channels missing that I would want to have...well possibly the history channel and foxsports

I don't think you have the option of ordering premium channels like HBO

The internet works fast enough for me...but sometimes the internet can slow to a crawl or just stop working, but usually if I wait a minute...it'll be back up. I don't know why this occurs...perhaps someone(s) are hogging up ALL the bandwidth...putting everyone else's internet to a crawl. Regarding the internet, for me, personally, it would not be the reason why I would move off-campus because I don't think it's bad enough to warrant that much consideration.
 
hylacinerea said:
Thanks for all the info! Could you expand on the quality of the school internet? What makes it so bad, is it really slow? What's the deal with the numerous children? I was not expecting that one. I guess I just thought there wouldn't be that many people with kids here. Plus I figured people with kids would want to live off campus anyway. Hmmn, now I'm a little freaked out that I'll be moving into some sort of daycare complex with crappy internet and cable for about the same price as living off campus.

Children without number! I like them; they're cute. They can, however, get rather noisy when playing in the hall (not that the drunken PA students on Thursday nights are any less so, and they keep worse hours). If you are studying in the library or are in that pleasant part of the year in which opening doors and windows means Certain Death From Heat, it's not a problem.

As for the internet, I may be a little more bitter towards it than Pooh Chong due to an inconvenient and day-long schoolwide outage a few months ago during the high season of boards studying. This is not unprecedented. Also, as Pooh noted, the internet does have a habit of slowing to a crawl frequently and without warning. To add insult to injury, the school has various use-rules (no streaming audio on a broadband connection?) which, though they seem to be rarely enforced, are irritating.

The main advantages of student housing, I think, are simplicity and proximity...you consolidate a lot of bills and get them taken care of through the normal finaid process, and can get to campus quickly. Those are significant advantages. I don't think, though, that they really offer a good deal compared to other places nearby beyond that.
 
I don't recall the day long outages...but my memory can be selective at times.

The main advantage, which lukewhite pointed out already, I like being able to get on and off campus quickly. I don't attend all the classes (the majority of classes)....and the on campus housing is perfect for that as I would have to either spend that time studying (in the library or cafeteria) or just stay in class.

I don't have problems with children in my building, so that problem is a bit of a random draw.
 
More on the bandwidth issue. Typically, download speeds from major sites like download.com are between 100-200kb/s. This is pretty impressive I think, although it would be interesting to find out just what (and how many) type of connections housing has. My guess would be a couple T1s split between all of housing. The real drag comes in the evenings and even more on weekends, when Chong and friends are tired of studying and want to download mp3z and porn all night.
Last time I was there, I installed a free program called "anyspeed" (on a friends pc) which measures bandwidth constantly, then gives you a plot over hrs, days, weeks. I never checked the long-term plots, but I know on some wknd nights it dragged down to 1.4kb/s and less.
When housing did their last internet upgrade, they should have tried to aliquot a certain bandwidth to each port, or at least tried to monitor bandwidth usage, and identified offenders like Chongy Pooh.

On the noise issue, the real problem is the damn echo in the courtyards. It seems to only be and issue when you have your windows open and you're forced to hear all of your neighbors make even more kids. There are quite a lot of kids though, but its more building specific.

First years, I would not recommend getting a normal 2 bedroom (with roommate). "Go big or go home", and enjoy life with the upgrade. I think the normal 2bdrms would be great for couples or with a family. I don’t know about you, but Id rather be studying medicine and not how to make my roommates death look accidental.
 
Is there a official, unofficial book list somewhere, Or even a class schedule for MSI.
thanks
 
Here's my advice for the first quarter Book/Supply list:
Netter Atlas (free from at least two clubs)
Netter Software (opt. I swear by this SW - make your own quizzes, it pronounces terms, give origins/insertions unlike the text. I even bought the PDA version for class breaks)
Moore & Dailey (opt. anatomy text used mostly for clinical coorelates)
Rohen (opt. photographic altas - very helpful outside of lab)
OMM Comlex Review Book (opt. Very helpful for first 2 yrs - in bookstore)
OMM Foundations Book (req'd But most of us still don't have it - $110)
Biochemistry Board Review (The exact title is in the bookstore; I liked this inexpensive paperback.)
Embryo by Sadler (I bought it because they test from it, but it stinks.)
Netter Embryo (opt. I bought it because I was waiting for Sadler before a test, somewhat useful but far down the priority list.)
Histo (There's several atlases that are used in class, I ended up with about 4 but they are available in the library for prepping before praticals.)
PDA w/ medical distionary (Few students had these, but I would highly recommend spending the $100. Highly efficient and portable way to survive ICM and the thousands of latin terms you're introduced to. I purchased both around Xmas & it made a huge difference.)

Physiology by Constanzo (2nd Qtr, get this book. After the Netter Atlas, the most useful text I have and the only one I really read. Plus it's cheap.)



MSI Class Schedule last year (2004-2005) which shouldn't change much:

Fall Quarter 23.4 quarter credits
CORE 1460 Interdisciplinary Health Care 0.5
ANAT 1511 Gross Anatomy I 5.0
BIOC 1511 Biochemistry I 7.0
FMED 1511 Clinical Correlates/ICM I 3.0
HIST 1511 Histology/Embryology I 4.4
OMED 1511 Osteopathic Medicine I 2.5
PSYC 1511 Intro. to Human Behavior I 1.0

Winter Quarter 23.5 quarter credits
CORE 1470 Interdisciplinary Health Care 0.5
PHYS 1521 Physiology I 5.5
ANAT 1522 Gross Anatomy II 5.0
BIOC 1522 Biochemistry II 4.0
CMED 1521 OCM I/Early Clinical Experience 0.5
FMED 1522 Clinical Correlates/ICM II 3.0
HIST 1522 Histology/Embryology II 1.5
OMED 1522 Osteopathic Medicine II 2.5
PSYC 1522 Intro. to Human Behavior II 1.0

Spring Quarter 24.0 quarter credits
CORE 1480 Interdisciplinary Health Care 0.5
FMED 1531 Topics in Medicine I 1.5
MICR 1531 Immunology 3.0
NEUR 1531 Neuroscience 6.5
PHYS 1532 Physiology II 5.5
CMED 1532 OCM I/Early Clinical Experience 0.5
FMED 1533 Clinical Correlates/ICM III 3.0
OMED 1533 Osteopathic Medicine III 2.5
PSYC 1533 Intro. to Human Behavior III 1.0
ELEC Electives *
 
Could anyone tell me what the estimated budget is for MS1 books?
 
Budgets vary widely. I know of one classmate that didn't purchase any books at all.

At a minimum for first quarter I would say Netter ($60 for club membership + free Netter) and a stethoscope ($75 and up). Plus you'll need to contribute with your lab mates to a lab Netter (around $20 unless someone donates a spare to the group). Then you'll really need Constanzo's Phys and Mihailoff's Text Atlas ($150) the last two quarters.

From there, the sky's the limit. I'm guessing the average budget for first year books and equipment is around a thousand, but that's just a guess.
 
hey, thanks for that awesome list! btw, what did you mean when you mentioned that some students got by without buying the required books? Is there a bunch at the library we can check out? or do students share books? Or perhaps the books are required just b/c the prof wrote it? :) Also, is there a particular software you recommend for the pda med dictionary? What about pdas, any particular kind that we need? I currently have a clie, but wanted to wait until 3rd yr to upgrade to another palm since i hear we don't really need it until wards. And anyone know if we'll get a back test cd like the MS1 got last yr?
 
larke28 said:
hey, thanks for that awesome list! btw, what did you mean when you mentioned that some students got by without buying the required books? Is there a bunch at the library we can check out? or do students share books? Or perhaps the books are required just b/c the prof wrote it? :) Also, is there a particular software you recommend for the pda med dictionary? What about pdas, any particular kind that we need? I currently have a clie, but wanted to wait until 3rd yr to upgrade to another palm since i hear we don't really need it until wards. And anyone know if we'll get a back test cd like the MS1 got last yr?


You can check out copies of current edition books...but as Refernce books, so they cannot leave the library...and they ask you to bring them back within 2 hours. If you study at the library...then you will not need to purchase that many books, but the vast majority do book certain books. For first quarter (because you will not buy 2nd quarter or 3rd quarter books until then), you only really need books for Gross Anatomy/Histology & Embryology (it's sort of taught as one really large class). There are books required for all the courses, but in most cases, they give out detailed notes that cover everything you need to know...so the required texts are not a big deal.

Here's my recommendation:
Netter, Atlas of Human Anatomy
McMinn, Color Atlas of Human Anatomy
Rohen and Yokochi, Color Atlas of Human Anatomy
Sadler, Langman's Medical Embryology (which I actually don't like)
More, Before We Are Born (this will save you in embryo..it's a much better book and Langman's)

Fall Quarter 23.4 quarter credits
CORE 1460 Interdisciplinary Health Care 0.5
NO BOOK
ANAT 1511 Gross Anatomy I 5.0
Netter
Rohen
Color Atlas of Human Anatomy
BIOC 1511 Biochemistry I 7.0
NO BOOK
FMED 1511 Clinical Correlates/ICM I 3.0
NO BOOK
HIST 1511 Histology/Embryology I 4.4
Moore
Sadler
OMED 1511 Osteopathic Medicine I 2.5
NO BOOK
PSYC 1511 Intro. to Human Behavior I 1.0
NO BOOK


I bought ALL of the books (and a ton more histology atlas') that are required for first year, if anyone wants to buy my books at 20% below bookstore rates then let me know. If you buy $500 dollars worth...I'll give you an additional 10%. Not a bad deal considering that a good number of my books are still in shrink-wrap and you won't have to pay taxes.
 
Here is a list that MDMiracle made last year, for the 2008 class. These are only first quarter books. I don't know if there are new editions, the will most likely stay the same though.
 

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Larke28,

Like Pooh Chong I purchased more books than I needed. But I don't study in the library much. If you have the opportunity, you might want to stop by the library and look the books over before buying any. As I understand it the public can enter the library without a Student ID during business hours.

As for PDA software there are several ways to do it. You can buy a separate program at full retail, or you can:

1) Buy Stedman's hardback like I did that includes both an MS Word dictionary (nice to have) and a PDA dictionary ($50 savings) all for around $60. I not positive on the price because I think this is another one I got for joining one of the clubs.

2) Purchase a Medical Software CD off Ebay that includes a PDA dictionary. I can almost guarantee that these won't include the software license so you're at risk of getting pirated stuff unless you shop carefully.

I use the Stedman's and it works great.

As for PDAs, I wouldn't go overboard. The PDA dictionaries work on just about anything in the last few years from what I can tell. I purchased a used Dell X3 on Ebay and paid $190 because I thought the wireless would be useful but I've used once. Without wireless, a good used one shouldn't run more than $100. But your Clie is probably just fine.

Finally, on the MSI/MSII CD-ROMs, we can certainly make copies. I'm not sure if anyone has taken time to update the ones we got from the (now) MSIIIs with last year's tests. I'll ask Tucker, our class Prez, about it this weekend. As a suggestion, if anyone from your class could provide disk space on a web server (500MB to 1GB) someone from our class could update and maintain a directory of MSI files. That might help clear through the clutter since there are several versions of CDs going around filled with mostly old, non relevant stuff. And everyone would have access to the same info.

Hope that helps!
 
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